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[Newbie] First Restoration. 2nd Ops Lathe. A Few Q's And 1 Issue.

Discussion in 'MACHINE RESTORATION & WAY SCRAPING' started by countryguy, Jun 25, 2016.

  1. countryguy

    countryguy United States Active User Active Member

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    Hi everyone. a year or two I purchased a hardinge turret lathe. DVM-59. It does run. Came w the cross-slide, collets, 2 chucks and a bunch of tooling. Cost was under 3 bills. I have finally started my first so-so restoration. the plan is to come out of this looking far better than when I started! :)
    Tore down for sandblasting yesterday (my first time on that too). I have some basic questions if you are willing to suggest a few things for me.

    1) The top turret adjustment cover-plate is cracked. someone braised it, but it is crooked. What I was thinking ?? a) try to mill that brass stuff off to clean it up and get it straight. ( see pics below) b) then do a v-groove grind w/ a re-weld from the bottom on it? (pic there too) There is room in the cavity. what would you do.
    2) Sand blasting- wow is that messy. but so easy! My Q: It is taking a bit of material out of the spindle head and top parts. I understand Hardinge used some type of concrete-resin special thing for these casr parts. Anything special on the sandblasting of equipment in general?
    I can smooth it all out w/ some filler and primer etc. bought some nice Oil base grey paint for her.

    3) cleaning! filthy and 50 years of gunk. Q: If I go get a parts washer what should I soak them in to loosed all the crud and clean this stuff up?
    3a- The cross slide chucks and turret mount - All dirty ugly brown. Would love to have them looking like this somehow: http://www.babinmachine.com/index.php?HARDINGEDV59

    Pics: broken part:
    broked-turretplate-web3.jpg turretbroke2-web4 (1).jpg

    before and making progress on tear down. Long way to go yet.
    turretb4-web2 (1).jpg turretparts-web1.jpg strippeddown-web5.jpg
     
    brino likes this.
  2. Ulma Doctor

    Ulma Doctor Infinitely Curious H-M Supporter-Premium

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    nice score on the DVM!
    as far as the repairs...
    if you have or have access to an oxy/acetylene torch, simply heat the casting to the melting point of the bronze - the broken piece will fall away, if it's not attached.
    if you have a new wire brush, or a small angle grinder or die grinder, prepare the area for a braze retry.
    if you can bevel the affected area without compromising the effective length, go for it.
    if you can v out the bottom side of the cover , braze it tall- then knock it back down with an angle grinder
    you'll need to somehow check for warpage of the casting upon completion of brazing work.
    there was signs of dragging on the inside of the cover. it's misalignment caused insufficient clearances between the cover and the operation linkage.
    inspection would be a good thing, there may be other small problems hiding.
    it makes me wonder how that cover was broken in the first place? :eek:
    just make sure to cover parts that are not going to be sandblasted, sand will get into any open void and can ruin precision bearing surfaces rapidly if unnoticed.
    if you don't have aversion to body filler, it can be used to fill imperfections in the finish previously removed by blasting.
    prep, prime, and paint to your liking.
    as far as cleaning solvents, there are a lot to choose from.
    you'll need to ask yourself, do i want a water based product or a solvent or other.
    purple power, simple green, orange clean, & like products are water based and are fairly effective

    i used to love Safety Clean solvent, it was delivered commercially .
    unfortunately it's poison and kinda hard to make go away after it's usefulness has passed.
    spent solvent is considered hazardous waste in most places and may or may not be an option for you.

    you can use water based degreasers in a parts tank should you have the desire.

    scraping would restore the bed, sandblasting is not recommended there.
    you could LIGHTLY stone the bed to see irregularities and have the added benefit of some oxide removal .
    evaporust can be used to remove rust, as can electrolytic rust removal.
    molasses/H2O mix will remove rust, as will vinegar.

    good luck, it will be nice to see what you decide.:)
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2016
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  3. countryguy

    countryguy United States Active User Active Member

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    Thanks a ton on the advice! On the broken part: Wife and I bought ourselves a oxy/act torch for our Xmas gift. I guess I will learn to braze soon. To help me learn/understand: Why not get it straight and hit it with the mig? Not sure when to braze vs weld.

    I think I will be pulling the head apart to inspect and clean. I do want to take a look at the bearings and spindle ( is it still a spindle on a lathe?) The coolent / grease / dirt / chips goo is everywhere inside this thing.

    Thanks much for the words of advice and encouragement.
     
  4. FOMOGO

    FOMOGO Puerto Rico Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Assuming the piece is cast, mig would be a poor choice. Tig, or brazing would work. Either way you would want to preheat and have it set up in some kind of jig to get a good result. As the Doctor said, tape off any critical surfaces before blasting. Should be a handy rig when you get her done. Mike
     
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  5. Ulma Doctor

    Ulma Doctor Infinitely Curious H-M Supporter-Premium

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    you are very welcome countryguy,
    cast iron doesn't really like to be welded, i'm not saying it can't be done-
    but trust me - brazing is your best option for many different reasons. ease of use being first and foremost.
    braze repairs are not as strong as the original casting in most cases, but, if it's not in an area of impact they generally survive well in my experience.
    mig is a great process for many things, but not well suited for repairs on cast iron.
    you can hit it with a nickle stick rod, but that's expensive and you'd have a heck of a time with heat distortion- not good.
    as mike suggested, pre heat at about 300-350*f and post slow cooling in ashes, sand, or earth are recommended for best result.

    yes it is called a spindle, you are correct.
    goo will get into every space imaginable, especially coolant fed machines.
     
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  6. vtcnc

    vtcnc H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Use glass bead or something less aggressive than the harsher black beauty grit to remove rust and paint. Do not hit ways, bearing surfaces or precision bores with the sand blaster.

    I used mineral spirit based parts cleaner with anti corrosion additive after bead blast on cast iron parts.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  7. Keith Foor

    Keith Foor Active Member Active Member

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    Couple things yo know on that lathe. First and for most is that bed is crazy flat. New they were flat as a good surface plate. That should NOT get blasted, sanded, dinged or molested. One that's worn is still far straighter than a good run of the mill lathes ways. Clean it with rags and acetone and wrap it in a blanket and set it safely away unless it's rusted or otherwise fouled. If that is the case, get it reground.

    Parts for those are still available from Hardinge. Stuff like gibs, lead screws and cross slide screws they have. Be warned, they ain't cheap.
    If you have a tempering oven put that casting in it and bring it up slow, then cool it off just as slow. The brazing should melt and run off separating the pieces. When you go to reassemble it, drill it and pin it together before brazing it. That will get it straight and hold things in place while you work.

    Remember that these second operation lathes will show significant wear in one area. My Feeler has a compound screw that the threads are so warn that they will cut you. And it's only in about a 2.5 to 3 inch area. The rest of it is good and tight.

    These lathes are very high precision and have excellent repeatability. That's what they are designed for are known for and had a price tag to match.

    The next step up was the HLV-H and those rebuilt sell for excess of $20K but the only buyers any more seem to be the medical field.

    The other thing to watch on those is the mounting system for the lathe. They ride on springs and are very stable. Reason is their accuracy is less effected by the lathe being level on the ground and having the cabinet twisted on the legs.

    I mentioned I have a Feeler that is a direct copy of a DV59. They are a great machine for what they excel at, second operation machining at a high tolerance. Don't cheap on the collets with these either. Crap collets may well be 1 or 2 tenths out of round. The lathe will hold better numbers than that if it's rebuilt properly.
     
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