Machining Work for an "Artist"...Is It Possible?

Phil3

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First, let me explain the title, and then my question. I am working with someone on a project that requires machining of some parts. We are friends, brought together by this person's desire to construct a project and my eagerness to use my lathe, mill, etc., to make some parts. All good, except for one thing. This person likes to "design" on the fly, making decisions about dimensions, locations, measurements, etc., at the same time the part is taking shape in the machine.

This other other person has a rough mental concept of what the final part and assembly of parts should be. For instance, drilling a hole. Where, how deep, hole diameter questions are all pretty much determined by eye-balling the part (in the milling machine), and only THEN deciding or modifying the answers to those questions. If the hole diameter looks a little too small after drilling, drill it slightly bigger. If a piece of aluminum is machined to 1/4 (0.250") thick, it may be taken out of the vice, examined, and then, "let's make it 0.050" thinner", etc. This goes on for any and all machining operations. There are rarely any drawings and at best, I might have a sketch, which seemingly constantly changes. As you might expect, it is impossible to machine anything without this person being present to make design decisions simultaneous with the machining of the part. This project will be made up of several parts.

Call me a purist or a perfectionist, but I find this maddening...I want a drawing! Complete with dimensions, tolerances, etc. The person says they are an "artist". I see that now, that approach resulting in their hands constructing something as directed only by a mental concept in their head that changes and evolves as the part takes shape . Maybe I am wrong, but I think that approach is just impossible for machining. Maybe the artistic approach works if one is sculpting something, like a statue, but I fail to see how this can work in a machine shop environment. I have pushed for 3D CAD drawings, but this appears to be the complete antithesis of the artistic approach.

I am not sure this partnership will work, but before I become insistent on what I need and the way this has to work, am looking for other perspectives.

Thanks.

Phil
 
Let him do it! Just make sure he pays for any damage he does.
Seriously, I had a boss like that once and I often wanted to strangle him. OK for prototyping but he never stopped with the changes even as we
were well into production. I'm retired now and happier.
Mark
ps what kind of parts are these?
 
Let him do it! Just make sure he pays for any damage he does.
Seriously, I had a boss like that once and I often wanted to strangle him. OK for prototyping but he never stopped with the changes even as we
were well into production. I'm retired now and happier.
Mark
ps what kind of parts are these?

Hi Mark,

Thanks for your reply. The person, in my opinion, is not safe around power tools. I have seen this demonstrated already on the mill and and table saw. As a result, I have already made it clear, only I operate the power tools. Paying for the damage is one thing, but I do not anyone injured while in my shop.

The parts are generally aluminum blocks and flat stock, plastic, and some wood.

Phil
 
I'm chuckling but I know it's not a laughing matter.
What I was asking was, what is this thing you are building- art or functional item? It seems like your friend isn't good at picturing shapes, sizes, dimensions- maybe you should make balsa wood models first? Are there strength issues that would dictate minimum thickness and size which you could point out to him ahead of time?
You could also point out that most machinists demand a drawing of some kind (even if it's in one's head) before starting a job, and don't allow many changes once cutting has begun
Mark
 
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Personally, I would not do it, even if you want to learn more. If you know how to drill a hole then how is drilling it one size larger going to teach you anything? If you can machine a part to 1/4" thickness, how does taking another 0.050" off teach you more? There are better ways to learn machining than to being taken advantage of. This guy is not your friend but if you think he is now, he won't be when you're done.

If he is willing to do it as a "cost plus plus" job, now maybe that might be worth the time, wear and tear on your equipment and aggravation. You could take a relaxed, peaceful approach to it while the cash piles up. If he does then charge him for every tool for the price you paid to buy it plus a percentage, all the material, wear and tear and your labor. If he won't do it this way then I would say goodbye and don't come back.

I've been on the receiving end of guys like this. Now I know better. Kick him out of your shop now, before homicide enters your mind.
 
Lots of people work like your "Artist" does, but they are not machinists. He needs someone to do the work, whether that someone is you or not is your decision. I understand your frustration but he may not.
 
Hi and welcome to the HM. I would get a 3D printer and make whatever the person dreams up. Then making and re-making is no big deal…Dave.
 
That is not at all an uncommon working style for creative arts, ceramics, painting, woodcarving etc. It is very common to start with a concept but to keep working the piece until it feels right.

It is about as opposite to working crafts like machining or carpentry (measure twice cut once) as you can get.


I could very easily sit down at my lathe and just create something interesting looking. It would drive me absolutely nuts doing it for somebody else. I don't imagine I would be very satisfied from the other end either.
 
I straddle both worlds, artist /mechanic/welder and now machinist. I rarely use plans but never start on anything I don't have a clear picture in my head of. And there are always "knowns" that are like the pivots for which the rest of the design has to take shape around. This is how I've always worked and it's frustrating for those who need plans. But I worked best with those I could explain what I need and line them out with enough to keep them busy while i took care of the sketchy stuff. As long as they did what I needed like I told them we worked great together.

Personally like Mikey and the others have pointed out, I could never work with a guy like that. These supposed artist types are just flakes. I KNEW early on asking somebody else to do what I should be doing for myself was a recipe for a mess so I slowly built up my machine tools. For me, designing by drawing or especially CAD just cross wires me and the creative idea just goes away. I have to have speed and momentum and asking somebody else do the work while trying to "feel" is like trying to take a shower with a rain coat on. It sounds like the guy should not be around machinery too so now way would I turn him loose with my equipment. Like Mikey said, bail before you kill him or he tries to use a machine and hurts you. YMMV.
 
Ah, the curse of of working with an Artist. As Aaron mentions, that's how they normally do their tasks. Alway fluid and changing.
Don't know if would necessarily call them flaky - they just operate with different mediums.
Myself, normally I have to do up a sketch and if I really want to complicate it I'll do up a drawing.
My creativity is limited to a straightedge, compass and a pencil so to say. If I were handed a hunk of wood and asked to carve something we'd end up with a bunch of shavings. I'm amazed at the artists in and around this area that carve a bear out of a hunk of tree trunk with a chainsaw and hand grinder.
A friend of ours does stained glass and that's the same thing. She'll cut and re-cut a piece of glass until it is just right, and then puts its all together into some breath-taking in my opinion.
Your Artist friend just doesn't understand the non-flexible nature of metals and machining...
 
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