3/4hp variable speed dc motor with control, from an untapped source

jumps4

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Newbie alert !!

I need to replace the motor on my 9x20 and these motors look like a great option. Since the motors I looked at were 3/4" shafts, can I get away with just boring the original motor pulley ? How about drive belt length ? Some pics of everyone's setups would be very much appreciated.
hi chrispy
here is the build thread for my 9x20 cnc conversion that includes the modifications to use this motor.

http://www.hobby-machinist.com/show...NC-conversion?highlight=9x20+lathe+conversion

steve
 

Chrispy1200

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jumps4

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I like to keep my mods so that what ever I do the machine can be returned to original. since this was the first time I had tried one of these motors and my original motor still worked fine I turned the shaft and cut the keyway.
steve
 

calipers

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Are you guys still happy with these motors? Any issues? I'm getting ready to order a taig lathe and will probably use one of the motors from this thread.
 

jster1963

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calipers: If you want to see one in action on a small lathe, take a look at my youtube vid. I'm no expert and don't have a lot of experience either. But from my limited experience, it seems to lack power on the low end. It may be that I have the wrong setup or something, but it seems like I can stall it at low rpm. Btw, I'm using a round rubber belt and that may be an issue too.

I love the variable speed and it may be that I have to learn how to use this motor correctly. ps. I've never had the real "original" type motor so I have nothing to compare this too (except a treadmill motor).

ps. ps. Any other questions, please don't hesitate to ask.
You can see the motor better at the end of the vid. (it's painted blue)
http://youtu.be/NpXN0RcNkeg
 

calipers

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calipers: If you want to see one in action on a small lathe, take a look at my youtube vid. I'm no expert and don't have a lot of experience either. But from my limited experience, it seems to lack power on the low end. It may be that I have the wrong setup or something, but it seems like I can stall it at low rpm. Btw, I'm using a round rubber belt and that may be an issue too.

I love the variable speed and it may be that I have to learn how to use this motor correctly. ps. I've never had the real "original" type motor so I have nothing to compare this too (except a treadmill motor).

ps. ps. Any other questions, please don't hesitate to ask.
You can see the motor better at the end of the vid. (it's painted blue)
http://youtu.be/NpXN0RcNkeg


Thanks jster1963! I'll be sure to check out your video.
 

Smudgemo

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Are you guys still happy with these motors? Any issues? I'm getting ready to order a taig lathe and will probably use one of the motors from this thread.
No real issues, but I replaced the one on my Benchmaster mill with a 1HP Baldor 3phase motor and a VFD because I wasn't in love with it. It wasn't bad (and maybe this is just more power now), but the current setup is way, way better for my mill.

I do think the sewing machine motor would make for a mighty fine shop-built belt grinder, so I've got some plans swirling around in my head for a future project.
 

Walltoddj

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Great idea to use a sewing machine motor variable speed torque and some with not brushes. Looks like a winner to me between $100-$150 for a new motor.

Todd
 

dogcatcher

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Another motor but more expensive and supposedly a better motor is the Reliable SewQuiet 5000 motor. Supposedly it doesn't lose any torque power at the lower speeds. I found one on Amazon for $200. I am currently using a Consew, but it loses some power at real slow speeds. The Consew is fine for what I do, but if I go this route again, I will l search more info about the slower speed torque loss. I would like to have a little more torque at 50RPM.
 

middle.road

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*Morning browsing-the-forum Ritual* First cup of coffee and I stumble on this.

I've got a 6" belt / disc grinder in pieces that has a fried motor, a rather large one at that.
Style is similar to this one -=- LINK -=-
What I was thinking was to forgo the disc and mount a motor on that end of the fried motor shaft.

Would one of these SMM's have enough ooomph to run the belt mechanism?

That would be cool to be able to have that type of speed control.

Thanks,
_Dan
 

Mark Lossner

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I like to keep my mods so that what ever I do the machine can be returned to original. since this was the first time I had tried one of these motors and my original motor still worked fine I turned the shaft and cut the keyway.
steve
hi chrispy
here is the build thread for my 9x20 cnc conversion that includes the modifications to use this motor.

http://www.hobby-machinist.com/show...NC-conversion?highlight=9x20+lathe+conversion

steve
Steve!
I filed this thread in my beady little brain for "later". Based on your threads, I took the plunge on that little motor for my 9 X 20 lathe. I should not have waited so long. Using that motor was a superb idea! Thank you so much for getting this ball rolling. I will post a thread one my conversion is complete. Thanks again!
Mark
 

jumps4

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It has been running about 2 years now and I'm still happy with it.
thanks for viewing
Steve
 

Mark Lossner

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It has been running about 2 years now and I'm still happy with it.
thanks for viewing
Steve
Steve, what did you do with that goofy magnetic sensor that was supposed to work with a foot pedal? It looks like you taped a magnet to it and then mounted it inside your control box. By the way, your CNC conversion is very impressive. Everything was well done, very professional looking.

I have figured out a way to replace the magnetic sensor board with a potentiometer and an op amp so that smooth speed control can be managed.

Mark
 

jumps4

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yes I just taped the magnet to it and use the original speed switch. I have seen where others used a pot there but it wasn't until after I had completed mine and I haven't found a reason to change it.
Steve
 

Mark Lossner

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Thank you so much for your reply. Now I'm not so sure that it is worth the trouble to do anything different. You've been a tremendous help. If I chase my neighbor away, will you move into their home?
 

jumps4

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No Sorry
I didn't move fare enough south as it is come winter.
Steve
 

Jessica

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This thread is quite old,

but in case someone like me is looking at it, the latest incarnation of this on eBay: "Consew-CSM3000-Sewing-Machine-Electric-Servo-Motor"

Works great for my Shop-Task 12-21!

You can actually reverse this easily without using the menu by crossing the black and red pair (2 of 3 motor coil drive wires,) then the yellow and brown pair (2 of 3 phase hall effect sensor wires) - I used a 4PDT switch to do the job. Be sure to bring the motor down to stop before reversing it, as the controller will instantly reverse the motor, but it is pretty violent.

A 1K pot works just as well as the 2.5K to replace the now magnetic speed control lever. The speed control uses a 2 to 4.6V signal, below about 1.8 to 1.9V the motor stops. From 2v to 4.1 the speed ramps linearly. The speed control lever has a +5, control and Ground wire. you can use a DMM to figure out which is which when you open it up.
 

MarkM

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Alot of Taig and sherlne owners are using the consew motors as well as Yuma sewing machine motors. I have to say on a Stuart Andrews aftermarket Taig frame these motors look to be the bees knees. Cutting steel like you would never think possible out of a modified Taig. They seem to be proven on the Taigs. I am considering one to make a planer/chipper knife and contemplating direct mounting or using a pulley.
 

OSidat

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This thread is quite old,

but in case someone like me is looking at it, the latest incarnation of this on eBay: "Consew-CSM3000-Sewing-Machine-Electric-Servo-Motor"

Works great for my Shop-Task 12-21!

You can actually reverse this easily without using the menu by crossing the black and red pair (2 of 3 motor coil drive wires,) then the yellow and brown pair (2 of 3 phase hall effect sensor wires) - I used a 4PDT switch to do the job. Be sure to bring the motor down to stop before reversing it, as the controller will instantly reverse the motor, but it is pretty violent.

A 1K pot works just as well as the 2.5K to replace the now magnetic speed control lever. The speed control uses a 2 to 4.6V signal, below about 1.8 to 1.9V the motor stops. From 2v to 4.1 the speed ramps linearly. The speed control lever has a +5, control and Ground wire. you can use a DMM to figure out which is which when you open it up.
Jessica, Thank you for sharing your insight into modding the consew connections.
I have another chinese model which is very similar to the consew CSM-1000/2000 series, albeit my controller has a dedicated tactical push button to change the direction of the motor, so I guess I do not need to mod the circuit for reversing the direction. However, since I had been looking up the addition of a Potentiometer as a speed control, I had been reading up various posts about it. Folks have modded this consew and similar motors and posted results on various forums since 2008 or so. One common comment on all Pot adaptations was using a 25K Pot.

Now I have tried a couple of versions and do face a common problem in all. The larger the POT resistance, the longer the controller requires to come out of its error display. Secondly, the range of turn is possibly 30 percent on all pots from motor start to maxing out in speed.

I cut out and isolated the original Hall-effect sensor circuit and measured it's resistance without it being connected to any part of the controller. I have a Red, Black and White wire on my specific model, where Red is positive, Black is ground and white is "Out". The sensor gives a idle state resistance of around 5.5K ohms. I am not an electronics person, but to me, this is indicative that when the motor/ controller set up is connected in its original form, with the foot pedal speed control assembly, the controller is getting a feedback from the foot pedal sensor of having approximately 5.5K resistance.

So, on my modification, I used a 5K Pot to have a variable speed control. When I used it as is, the controller digital display shows an error at start up. As I turn the Pot about 30 percent through its range, the error disappears and the motor starts. By the time I reach about 60 percent of turning the knob, the motor speed max out. So, taking queue from the Hall sensor resistance reading, I added a 5K fixed resistor to the black wire which in my adaptation is connected at position 1 of the POT to give me clockwise speed increment. This resulted in making the start error go away, and now the motor starts after just a fractional turn of the knob. But it is still maxing out in motor speed as I reach at around 60 percent of the turn.

I am not sure, if this partial usage of the Pots full rotation is normal or am I doing something wrong here.

I have my Red wire connected to POT 3, Black to POT 1 with a 5K added, and White is on the POT 2 Wiper connection.

Any insight would be extremely helpful.
 

Jessica

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Hi OSidat,

The Hall sensor doesn't actually mimic a Pot, rather it is more like an OP amp. You cannot measure the output resistance with a DMM without a bit more cleverness. Its output resistance is a few to tens of ohms depending on the precise model. I don't know the precise model they are using but it is similar to an Allegro Micro systems A1308KUA-1-T. I actually worked at Allegro many years ago on Hall sensor products as my first engineering job!

Just as a basic check, When using a Pot, be sure one end of the Pot is connected to the sensor +5 and the other end is connected to sensor ground. The wiper goes to what was the hall sensor output. You must disconnect the Hall sensor output also. If it is in parallel, weird things will happen.

Really the best thing is a Pot with an op amp buffer, but a low value Pot works well on my model without errors. I also used a non-inductive Pot, but only because that is what I had in the junk box. I am not sure if a wire wound pot would be a problem, but because the original sensor is an op amp like output, I would expect some potential trouble.

The funny behavior you see is probably due to the finite input resistance of the controller circuit interacting with the way way higher resistance of the pot vs. what the hall sensor output acts like. Further if there is any sort of captive input filter in the controller, the longer delay with higher pot resistance is expected. Similarly, if too low a Pot value is used, the current draw from 5V would be much to high, and it would not work properly.

Try a 1K pot, or, lacking that, you could try lacking a 1k pot or an op amp in your hand would be to drive the speed sensor line with a variable power supply through a 100 ohm resistor. Tie the power supply negative to the negative of the sensor. Vary the voltage from 0 to 4.5V and see how the motor speed changes. It should be zero up to some threshold, then ramp fairly linearly to the max set speed if it is set up like the one I have.
 

C-Bag

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Except for the electrical figuring this looks like a wonderful problem solver for my 9x20 and some other projects like for my sheetmetal beader. Thanks for reviving this old thread Jessica. I'd never seen it before.
 
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