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B&S 618 Micromaster Wheel Sleeve Source?

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Janderso

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#1
Hello,
I am the proud new owner of a hydraulics operated surface grinder.
There is only one wheel sleeve.
As I understand it, you neeed to have one for each wheel to make the set up much more efficient.
I’m sure I will need other parts and pieces, oil, etc.
I do have the original operation and maintenance manual
Thanks for your help,
Jeff
 

Bob Korves

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#3
Jeff, "ideally" we would like to have wheel adapters for each wheel. That can get quite expensive quickly. Here is the style your Micromaster uses (Alexander is correct):
http://www.wmsopko.com/sopko_04_to_30_51_53.htm
They need to be left hand thread wheels, and need to fit the correct width wheel. Your new grinder appeared to have a 7" wheel on it, but I think I remember John York mentioning 8" wheels for that grinder. Check the manual before ordering anything. I have heard that is is proper to use adapters with a flange diameter 1/3 or more of the wheel diameter, though I have seen that not followed, along with using RH adapters instead of LH if they are on hand. I follow safety advice from reliable sources. The one that was on the grinder was sized like a Sopko 200-1 (but looked like a different brand.) I have bought 200-1 wheels for under $55 each new, but that is a very rare find. Retail price is much higher. Used adapters are a crap shoot. Damage to the taper, rust, crashes in use, and other issues can make them pretty useless, and damaged ones can look fine holding them in your hand. They really need to be pretty nice, and carefully kept that way.

When wheels are remounted to an adapter, they need to be dressed, because they will be out of round. Some grinder hands swear by balancing the wheel/hub combination, others say it is mostly a waste of time. I have found cheap wheels to have more balance problems than quality wheels. I do not balance my 7" wheels, so far. 8" wheels might make me rethink that choice. ALWAYS use the toothed I.D. washer that helps to stop the wheel from coming loose from inertia. They are fairly cheap and necessary.
 

benmychree

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#4
If you use keyed washers behind the adaptor threaded flange nut that are keyed to the threaded portion f the adaptor, you can use RH adaptors on spindles that revolve clockwise and normally use LH flanges.
Bob, I do not quite get what you are calling "toothed washers", please elaborate.
 

Bob Korves

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If you use keyed washers behind the adaptor threaded flange nut that are keyed to the threaded portion f the adaptor, you can use RH adaptors on spindles that revolve clockwise and normally use LH flanges.
Bob, I do not quite get what you are calling "toothed washers", please elaborate.
Toothed washers = keyed washers. :)

I have one RH wheel adapter (got it from you!), and I have used it with the keyed washer, no trouble so far, but I check it every time I turn the spindle off. With the VFD on my grinder, I turn the machine gradually up to speed and then down until the spindle turns off, probably zero chance of problems, and the keyed washer also helps to keep it from unscrewing. Still, I have read stern warnings not to use RH adapters if the wheel turns clockwise, and it often is wise to pay attention to warnings. Being able to slowly ramp up the spindle to speed, and also turn it down slowly, also helps to keep the wheel from slipping on the adapter, helping to keep the wheel true. The belt drive to my spindle otherwise slows the spindle down fairly quickly at shutdown, which is not the case with a motor/spindle.
 
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benmychree

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#7
Its a washer with keys to go in to the double key way of the hub, if torque is applied to the
grinding wheel this prevents the washer from spinning and intern loosening the lock nut.
http://toolroom.solutions/wp-conten...er-taper-fit-wheel-adapter-w-ring-set-web.jpg
True, but that was unclear from Bob's reference, I made it more clear in my post. I just bought four adaptors from a member, one was not threaded at all, so I threaded it and milled key slots in it for the washer. The adaptors that fit my Micromaster also fit my Norton T&C cutter grinder, all 3" TPF and about .990" dia. at the big end of the taper, with diameters suited to 6" dia. wheels.
Sopko also makes wheel adaptors with a balancing feature, I have one, found on EB in a lot of others, a quite expensive item, and not necessary for most any work, if quality wheels are used. I had one wheel, made in Italy, I think that was so badly out of balance as to be unusable and not worth the trouble of trying to balance, that I finally threw it away.
B&S, in their operator's book for the Micromaster grinder suggests in the case of a badly out of balance wheel to gouge out a recess in the light side of the wheel. where it will be hidden under the wheel flange, and inserting lead into the recess to balance it; this to me is under the definition of too much trouble! They also suggest removing the bushing material in the wheel center (sulfur compound or lead) and re centering the wheel and rebushing it with whatever material one has on hand, such as lead or the sulfur compound. The sulfur compound can be salvaged from old worn out wheels, or use anchor bolt sulfur.
 

Janderso

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#8
You guys are too much, you act like machinists.
I think I will wait to order any parts, adapters etc. Until the SG is in my space.
I am very excited about my new acquisitions.
The shaper is sweet.
 

Bob Korves

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#9
Getting a surface grinder to cut accurately to size, square, and parallel, along with each entire surface dead flat and with an outstanding surface finish, all at the same time, is a challenge. Well, it is for me, anyway. Pick any three, no problem, we can usually get there.
 

Janderso

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#10
I have been watching YouTube videos focusing on the surface grinder.
Suburban Tool and Solid rock machine shop have (IMHO) have some excellent videos on set-up, wheel mounting and balancing to grinding, flat, square and perpendicular.
Vintage machinery ground a new beveled gib for the big Monarch crosslide. He used the magnetic sine plate, showed the math. Very informative.
it's interesting, Don Bailey, places the diamond dresser directly under the center of the wheel, every other video shows the trailing side set-up.
Thanks for the sopco lead Bob.
 

Bob Korves

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#11
Placing the diamond directly under the wheel center is OK, and necessary for dressing accurate form wheels, but not ANY upwind of the wheel center. For most dressing, half an inch downwind is perfectly fine. The diamond should not be vertical to the chuck, it should be angled downstream, by 5 to 10 degrees. The diamond is turned in its holder a little every few uses so as to always have a sharp point and facets. A sharp diamond and the proper traverse rate is the key to a good dress. The proper traverse rate and amount to cut per pass depends on the wheel and the job, and is part of the art of surface grinding. I am not an artist, and probably will never be, but I am trying to learn each time I use the surface grinder, and my other tools.
 

Bob Korves

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#12
When dressing a wheel for cutting softer metals, and for roughing work , it often helps to use a very fast traverse for the last pass, which leaves a "thread" in the wheel face. The grooves leave room for swarf to accumulate, and help to keep the heat in the part down. Diamond wheel dressing requires light cuts, which can be different depending on the wheel. For common wheel dressing, I do not go over a thou and a half per pass, usually one thou or less. Dressing aggressively is a good way to to destroy a diamond. I have no experience at all with using diamond cluster dressers, but would like to know more about when and how to use them, and why.
 

Cadillac

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#13
My understanding of a cluster diamond is no need to rotate. The wheel finds the high one. I have two but haven’t used them.
My question is yes you should have the diamond mounted at a angle in the block5-10 degrees going downstream. But I heard and seen that you should be cutting into the diamond. If mounted the way we are isn’t it pulling the diamond? Which could pull the diamond out of the holder? It makes sense but then how you would position the dresser would be on the dangerous side or you’d have to put that 5-10 angle facing the wheel. Idk
 

Bob Korves

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I have seen people pointing the diamond against the diamond, and heard that is correct, but when I watch the real pros doing it, they point it downstream. I would think there is more chance for damaging the diamond when pointed against the rotation, but just guessing and trying to learn. I have not lost a diamond yet...
 

Bob Korves

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#15
My understanding of a cluster diamond is no need to rotate. The wheel finds the high one.
And eventually wears all the diamonds flat and pretty much useless?
 

Cadillac

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#16
And eventually wears all the diamonds flat and pretty much useless?
Yeah I don’t know. I had got mine in a auction lot the place had some big grinders 14,16” wheels 3” wide maybe used more for big wheels?
Unfortunately I don’t know enough yet to tell the difference between worn diamond,wrong wheel,or what. More like trial and error.
 

Janderso

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#17
I think I'll make the diamond dresser holder, but when I purchase the diamond, I'll consult a higher authority.
This Forum.
 

Cadillac

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#18
I think I'll make the diamond dresser holder, but when I purchase the diamond, I'll consult a higher authority.
This Forum.
Whooo your gonna ask the wife about diamonds? That’s gonna cost ya!;)
 

Dabbler

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#19
On the question about wearing out diamond points for a dresser... My friend and menotr has sued the same 1 ct diamond for 38 years. When he gives up his shop, he'll be giving it to me. I don't expect to wear it out.

why?

First, it is a natural diamond. they wear much better. Second, you only take a few thou off the wheel once it is intially dressed, so the pressure is very low. third, you wear a diamond by fracturing the surface, so a smooth even pressure works well and avoids micro fractures,

I have a 1/4 ct and a 1/2 ct man made diamonds to use on my grinder at home until the good one is available. Probably I'll not be wearing out the 1/2 ct in my lifetime.
 
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