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Bardale

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#1
> As a first off I am building the Eliot Isaacs Beginners Clock. I have
> completed the solid pattern Pallet Arms to the dimensions shown on the
> relevant drawing. This shows the pallet arm radius as 1.25" however on
> reading the setting up details in the text it indicates that this
> dimension should be 1.183". Before I start to carve out a new pallet has
> anyone made the clock to the drawing dimension of 1.25" with successful
> results?.
I know that Brian based his weight driven clock on Eliot Isaacs design and I hope he will be able to advise.
Many thanks
 
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#2
Hi Bardale
My apologies for not answering earlier, I somehow missed this post.
My pallet arms are made to 1 1/4" and the clock runs perfectly.
Are you making the standard version or the one with the Alec Price mods that allow it to run for 8 days ?
Regards Brian.
 

Bardale

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Hi Bardale
My apologies for not answering earlier, I somehow missed this post.
My pallet arms are made to 1 1/4" and the clock runs perfectly.
Are you making the standard version or the one with the Alec Price mods that allow it to run for 8 days ?
Regards Brian.
Hi Brian
Many thanks for your reply, much appreciated.
I did build a weight driven clock to John Wildings instructions many moons ago so I thought I would stick to the standard version as a first off spring driven effort.
Regards
Another Brian!!
 

Bugleone

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#4
First post, so 'hello' everybody....

I have made the Eliot Issacs Beginners clock using the second drawing for the pallet arms at 1.25 inches from pivot to pallet...However I have not been able to get the clock to run and neither have two clock experts, one a former restorer with the Sience Museum in London....... I am now making the pallet arms to the 1.183 dimension. I'm using the Alec price improvements. I would be interested in any remarks!
 

Bardale

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First post, so 'hello' everybody....

I have made the Eliot Issacs Beginners clock using the second drawing for the pallet arms at 1.25 inches from pivot to pallet...However I have not been able to get the clock to run and neither have two clock experts, one a former restorer with the Sience Museum in London....... I am now making the pallet arms to the 1.183 dimension. I'm using the Alec price improvements. I would be interested in any remarks!
Hi Bugleone(?)
I have completed the going train on the basic clock and have tried pallet arms to both of the dimensions. I have been able to get it to run for a couple of hours but no more than that. Had to put it away for a while while I complete some "can you just" jobs for my son. I have bought the John Parslow book for a skeleton timepiece which is a modified version of the Alec Price version of the Eliott Issacs clock and it has a few ideas that I will pursue next. I had lots of suggestions from another forum which I have tried without success.I will report back if I have any success.
Brian Barrow
 

Bugleone

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Bardale,..thanks for speedy reply!....What was the other forum that you tried please? Also, what size spring have you used?
 

Bardale

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Bardale,..thanks for speedy reply!....What was the other forum that you tried please? Also, what size spring have you used?
Hi, the other forum is a yahoo groups forum,"Horology for mini lathes". I simply ordered a spring from Ian T Cobb's listings, he is in the UK and a google search will bring up his website.
 

Bugleone

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I have finished the new pallet arm to the 1.183inch dimension and the clock will not run at all. I am reliably told that it cannot work with this pallet as it is too small. I am currently re-trying the 1.25inch arm.

I'm still looking for ANYONE out there in the world at large who has made this clock and got it to run properly....?
 

Bardale

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The best I have had from the basic clock is about 2 days using the 1.25"arm.
Have a look at http://www.deansphotographica.com/machining/projects/clockmaking/clockmaking.html this is the basic clock but using lantern pinions. I will try to attach a photo of my clock but it may go pear shaped.
I have reached the point where I might change to the Parslow clock as this uses most of the basic clock parts.
 

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Bugleone

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Bardale,.......thanks for reply. Are you the same man who has the 'Deans Photographica' site? If you are, then I have looked at your site many times and wondered how to contact you as yours is the ONLY begginers clock that I have ever bee nable to find on teh web....i have been wondering if you ever finished/added to your clock! If you are 'Dean' then you do nice work! My own clock is quite different to the published design now....I shall try to work out how to post pix here, and then may post a few myself as it would be a nice contrast to the image you have just posted.
 

Bardale

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Sorry Bugleone but I am not "Dean" Just post your pictures as "Attach Files" at the bottom of this screen.
 

Bugleone

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This is my version of the E.Issacs Beginners clock which I made about three years ago but which I have not been able to get working....used the A. Price improvements but much of the clock is adapted to be at least a little bit more attractive as the original is rather ugly, frankly! I made everything in the clock except for the spring and two tiny adjusting screws on pallet arm (not shown)........most of the clock is made from scrap and off-cuts, the dial is made from epoxy putty and then polished to look like enamel......... Sorry I mistook you for 'Dean'.
IMG_3470.JPG
 

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#13
Hi I am away from home on holiday in Scotland at the moment but will be home on Monday.
I changed the design of my version of this clock from spring drive to get greater control over the power and to extend the running time..
I had a lot of trouble getting mine to run properly. the problems came down to the point on the pallets where they caught the escape wheel, this must be on the curve, if it is to deep the tip of the wheel cannot slide on the pallet. also the angle of the pallet had to be altered to ensure that the
wheel cleared the pallet cleanly and also did not foul the next tooth, this got the clock running but not reliably.
the reliability problem was solved by reducing the weight of the pendulum bob and replacing the steel rod with one made from aluminium, another point is that is very sensitive to getting the beat correct.
If I was making this clock again I would use a lighter suspension spring,

My clock now keeps good time and runs for 10 days.

Brian.
 

Bardale

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Hi Brian, many thanks for your suggestions. I have made a few alterations and the clock is ticking at the moment, for how long I will have to wait and see!! I think that the choice of the very basic clock may have been a mistake but it has provided a learning project. I like the modifications to the frame design that Bugleone has used, hope he manages to get it going.
Regards
Brian
 

Bugleone

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#15
I am still trying to get my clock to run. A fresh discovery is that I can get the clock to continue to run if I supply minimal finger pressure to the wheel bellow the 'scape wheel....... This now makes me think that the clock has a 'power supply problem', although on the advice of a top horological conservator I have already made another spring barrel and installed a more powerful spring.

If the clock cannot be made to run in the next few days/weeks then I have been told of a man who should be able to suggest an alternative escapement that I can substitute the existing one without changing the basic clock too much,...hopefully just the pallet arm and 'scape wheel.
 

Bardale

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Hi Bugleone
My basic clock has run for two days on a half winding. It is now ticking away on a full winding. When your clock stops are both the pallets free of the scape wheel in which case something is binding in the drive train. I reset the pallet arms and the scape wheel back into the depthing tool and took a long time just studying the action, I plugged the existing pallet arbour hole and redrilled it to a new dimension, after making a new back cock plate without the slotted holes. I then took a long time making micro adjustments to the pallet arm and back cock pendulum drive. Fingers crossed looks to have worked.
 

Bugleone

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Interesting!...(and thanks for reply!)

I have two alternative 'stoppages'.........most common is that a tooth of the 'scape wheel catches on the edge of the pallet. It stops the clock with a little shudder and the 'scape tooth is right on the edge of the pallet flat. About every third 'stop' the clock just stops with no apparent reason.

..............I don't think my clock could actually stop with both pallets free of 'scape wheel........either one must be engaged if pallet arm is made to published dimension (1.25inch pallet to arm pivot)...for the scape wheel to be between the pallets then the "1 21/64inch" dimension would have to be badly wrong, but then again, who knows?...!!
 

Bugleone

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.....Congratulations on getting your clock to run bye the way!!
 

Bardale

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#19
I have now completed my Elliot Isaac's clock ,it will run for just over 48 hours and keeps reasonable time for such a basic clock.
Not up to the same complexity as some of the superb clocks on this forum but a bit of a change from my usual steam engines.
 

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Bugleone

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#20
Bardale,...congrats on finishing your clock!...it looks very nicely made and I like the face. By coincidence I have been working carefully on my clock during the last week.....last week I gained a copy of the book about making the so called 'Parslow Clock'. In fact this is actually the Elliot Issac clock with the Alec Price improvements. The contribution by John Parslow is minimal to the extent that merely removes the backcock adjustability and suggests a heavier pendulum bob. However, the real bonus of his book is to confirm some of the doubtful dimensions such as the pallet arm, and to explain in better terms how the escapement actually works.

I have been perusing the book and currently my clock is disassembled for measuring and analysis. Tomorrow morning I shall start reassembly using the Parslow setting up instructions.

Over Christmas a friend who is a good 'clock man' and a retired engineer managed to get my clock to run overnight on his bench but i have been unable to duplicate his achievement so far.....However, I do now feel more encouraged about the clock that any other time in the last few years!

.....As they say; "watch this space".......
 
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#21
Hi Brian
Have you tried a lighter pendulum bob just take of the bob and replace it with a couple of 6mm nuts for a trial. this made a great difference to the reliability of mine.
Also the clock is Very sensitive to getting the beat correct the slightest tilt left or right will stop the clock . to get this right the clock needs to be mounted firmly on a base that can be adjusted IE held lightly in a vice, the ticks and tocks must be of equal length. don't worry if the clock ends up tilted slightly to one side this can be altered later.
When running the swing of the pendulum is very small probably only14mm or so.
I cannot understand why the adjustment for the back cock has been removed because you require this to get the drop on the scape equal.
Mine continues to run very reliably and is much admired by visitors, so keep at it I am shure you will win in the end.
Brian.
 
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