Carbide Tools With Shaper

Hi Dranreb, thanks for the info,I'll stick with hss as I've picked up loads over the years from autojumbles & car boot sales, your video is mesmerising, there used to be a really massive butler hydraulic shaper at college & boy could you take "bonus cuts" with that, as well as my alba I also have a 10"elliot,a favourite with model engineers,the price was right & I couldn't resist it about 30 yrs ago, then you could pick them up for peanuts but they seem to be really sought after now & shooting up in price, I bought an adept hand shaper for about a fiver about 45 yrs ago & sold it a few yrs later for £18.00 when I got the alba & was well pleased with myself, I've now seen them change hands on ebay for up to £2oo.oo !!
Graham.
 
Yep, shapers used to be free to take away, I blame the steam punk movement for boosting prices beyond retail+ levels as they're the nearest thing to a plug in steam engine there is!

Obviously the rail would have been more secure with less interruption with the vice turned 90deg, but where's the fun in that!

Ooops steam punk philosophy must be rubbing off on me.... :grin:

Cheers

Bernard
 
Hi Norton Dommi, I hav an alba 1a but not got a handbook for it but to br honest there's not much to go wrong with them as long as you keep it lubricated at all the oiling points you either love'em or hate'em [I love 'em] like the name would that be "88" "99" or 650ss? I sold my ss to my younger brother about 40 yrs ago for £80 so I could buy a brand new myford super 7 B lathe about £350 at the time,I still have the lathe & he still has the bike[grrr] doesn't use it & the bikes worth more than the lathe now!
Graham.
 
G'Day Artfull-codger,
Yep lots of info on Atlas. Elliot ect was just asking, you never know your luck aye?
Funny thing about shapers like you say, love 'em or not. Personally I would not like to be without one.
The Norton is a '58 Dommi 99 one of the last days production with a mag. Still got the original rims but re-laced with HD stainless & Akront alloys 18" & 17" to run modern rubber. 1 1/2" lower, about 3 1 /2" lower CG.
The old ads said "takes corners like on rails", that was true with original rubber, better now. I used to like to run around hardly makeitsons on corners. Still great on gravel as well.
Parked up for now as I am under an indefinate ban, Back to court next year! :(. Summer here as well so double damn.
Back to biz. I have just re-located a Google scan of 'Shaping & Planing 1915' and are looking at making a mount to generate gears by the generation method. There is a great description in the 1st chapter. The only other reference that I have seen to this is an article by "Base Circle" from a 1960's 'Model Engineer' article which can be found on the N.E.ME.S. site. I'll post as soon as I have time.
Very nice to hear from a fellow Alba owner with good taste in two wheels & you had the best, the 650 SS could run rings around just about anything & didn't top out out at eighty aye?
_ Cheers,
Barry.
 
Everybody has something in the workshop that's just a nice to have and my little Alba 1A is one such machine. I have a pdf copy of the manual if anybody wants a copy
 
Hi Kennlinderman,
Yes please, I'd love a copy. How do we arrange?
Two things while I'm here getting back to Pete301's original topic. Yes I've used Carbide & have had some problems with chipping, at it's worst when cleaning up rusty old scrap in which case HSS seems to work better. For now seem to have solved by grinding a very low clearnce angle for the heel. This was on a couple of cheap brazed tip lathe tools,(once in a hurry I even tried an inserted tip tool. Don't!), Now make my own brazed tip tools from discarded solid tips. I bought a large bag of about 5lbs for NZD$20 which will last me a lifetime.
Going to try a couple of uploads which I hope some will find of interest, oldies but goodies.
-Barry.
 

Attachments

  • Gear cutting by Generation.zip
    26.3 MB · Views: 291
  • Planing and Milling 1915.zip
    7.8 MB · Views: 305
When I first (back in the dark ages) bought the Atlas (S-7), I experimented with several cutters. On the carbide brazed tools, I used brazed tip lathe tooling right out of the box from Harbor Freight. No sharpening, polishing or anything. The steel grade is the biggest unknown there. It could have been anything. Likely something I stole from the (steel) mill where I was working. The finish was good enough to comb my hair with. The carbide tip didn't chip or wear bad, I used it later on a lathe. So, it must not have dulled much, at least on the edge I used. No serious production work, tho.

The frame structure I use for a shop won't support a heavy mill. I must consider weight when buying a machine. I don't use it much, mostly because I am a EE and don't use the machinist tools of any form much. But, when I need it, it's there. With a carbide cutter. Lacking the straight tool holder, I don't much use HSS on the shaper. There isn't anyone close by that does machine work as a hobby, so most of my knowledge comes from books and web sites such as this. The shaper came to me before the Net or eBay were a big thing. Learning was a bear then.
 
G'Day Artfull-codger,
Yep lots of info on Atlas. Elliot ect was just asking, you never know your luck aye?
Funny thing about shapers like you say, love 'em or not. Personally I would not like to be without one.
The Norton is a '58 Dommi 99 one of the last days production with a mag. Still got the original rims but re-laced with HD stainless & Akront alloys 18" & 17" to run modern rubber. 1 1/2" lower, about 3 1 /2" lower CG.
The old ads said "takes corners like on rails", that was true with original rubber, better now. I used to like to run around hardly makeitsons on corners. Still great on gravel as well.
Parked up for now as I am under an indefinate ban, Back to court next year! :(. Summer here as well so double damn.
Back to biz. I have just re-located a Google scan of 'Shaping & Planing 1915' and are looking at making a mount to generate gears by the generation method. There is a great description in the 1st chapter. The only other reference that I have seen to this is an article by "Base Circle" from a 1960's 'Model Engineer' article which can be found on the N.E.ME.S. site. I'll post as soon as I have time.
Very nice to hear from a fellow Alba owner with good taste in two wheels & you had the best, the 650 SS could run rings around just about anything & didn't top out out at eighty aye?
_ Cheers,
Barry.
Hi Barry, sorry about the dalay been soo busy!! yes the good old "featherbed" frame mine was slimline but the older versions were wideline often used to make Tritons,I like the sound of yours, the primaty chaincase [pressed metal]was a let down leaking oil, I had a go on my old bike when my brother brought it up but the clutch was soo stiff & arthritis in the thumbs made it too difficult but I think you can get a diaphram clutch [lighter to pull] instead of the springs.
Regards Graham.
 
Generally speaking, it is recomended to have a tool lifter when using carbide on a shaper or planer to prevent chipping. Personally, I see no need to use carbide either on a shaper or planer. With HSS tools properly ground with minimum clearance angles, one can take off the chips quickly enough, besides, the HSS chips are quite hot enough, they can burn the crap out of you, the carbide chips are bound to be hotter yet.
Years ago, I ran a big planer, 6ft. X 6ft. X 15ft; one of the other apprentices was quite proud at using carbide tools on it and making blue chips; I tried using my own HSS tools 3/4 X 1", ground as I have said and found that I could make the same cuts he made at the same table speeds and feeds with the chips coming off cooler and more freely.
 
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