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Disappointed in abilities with 12" Logan

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Investigator

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#1
I'm very frustrated, somewhat with my machine but mostly with me. The short version is I need a steady rest but cant find one.

My 2537 12" turret lathe has been making chips for a while now. I'm not by any stretch of the imagination a machinist, but I have been able to make what I have needed so for. All of my projects have been small. I've made bushings and and a few odd parts here and there. This is just me in my shop at home for fun.
But I have a big project to work on for myself. I have been planning on making a few suppressors for my rifles. I've got all the legalities covered and all is on the up and up.

The issue is I have some 4140 round bar about 14" long to make the baffles out of. Baffles will be 60* cones to fit inside a 1.5"ID tube. The best, as I understand it, way to make them is chuck the bar up, and use a steady rest to support it while I work a baffle at a time on the far end. So that means I need a steady which didn't come with the lathe.

Necessity is a mother, so I make a steady.........The first version was a hexagon shape about 10" diameter. I'm sure you can already see the problem. I made it from .5x.750" bar stock, welded, threaded 120* apart. It looked good, but when I put it on and turned the machine by hand, there was so much flex in the fingers I was afraid to even turn the machine on. So back to the drawing board.

The second steady was made from wood. I used 3 layers of 3/4" birch glued and screwed together. I had a 4" hole in the center and again fingers at 120* apart. The fingers were 1/2-13 bolts which I turned and tipped with brass. Unfortunatly there is too much movement in the wood itself I guess. As I start to take light cuts on the surface, it works loose and starts flexing. I have been watching Ebay and can't find a Logan Steady rest and dont know if anything else will fit.

I'm really disappointed in my self and in the project so far. So much so I had to just leave the shop. As bad as it sounds I am considering selling the Logan and getting a new import lathe that comes with a steady and tail stock, which I also don't have and would like to have. Right now my project is stopped and I can't do anything about it.

I just wanted to try to share the weight on my shoulders, confession being good for the soul and all, and share my tale of woe.
 

markba633csi

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#2
Take a look at some factory steady rests and some home brew ones too, get some inspiration before the perspiration. I would put roller bearings on the tips if I was making one. Not a project I could whip out in a day- more like a couple weeks or more. Don't give up.
Mark
 

agfrvf

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#3
For some unknown reason there is a tax on 12" steady rests.
 

Investigator

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#4
Not a project I could whip out in a day- more like a couple weeks or more. Don't give up.
Mark
Thats part of the issue. I've already spent over 3 weeks working on building steady rests, and I am no closer to having a working one that I was when I started.
 
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#5
Search "Steady Rest" on this Forum. You will find a few that were built by our members.

"Billy G"
 

markba633csi

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#6
Probably it takes more strength and rigidity than you realized, that's why they often are made of cast iron. Also why you often find broken ones for sale LOL It's not an easy device to build though, a lot of details to work out
M
 

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#7
Probably it takes more strength and rigidity than you realized, that's why they often are made of cast iron. Also why you often find broken ones for sale LOL It's not an easy device to build though, a lot of details to work out
M
I agree. the bar is 2" round, 14" long trying to turn at about 200 RPM. I have no idea how to figure the force involved, but it has to be huge. I think what I built would work for cutting the 1.625" tubing, as it is only .058" wall thickness. But the solid bar is too much mass.
 

Uglydog

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#8
I'd keep the Logan unless she is very tired over any new shiny machine. But, that's my old iron preference.
Making one is a definite option. Just gotta find the best combination.
Did you see this post. Possibly more than you want to pay. However, there is more there than just the steady!!
Don't know the seller. Have not seen the parts...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/LOGAN-12-i...654365?hash=item4b3751ca9d:g:2GsAAOSw38BaaObL

Daryl
MN
 

Uglydog

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#9
I just got called a local friend who is not a HM member.
He has a barn full of misc. He is pretty sure that he has something in that size range.
PM me if you want his contact information. If not an actual bolt on, you might be able to make one of his work using one of his steadys.
I'm sure the price would be very right.

Daryl
MN
 

jwmay

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#12
Just to follow up my link, I understand your frustrations. I had similar troubles, and my solution was to buy an import. I’m very happy with it. But I’ll always be watching for another old lathe like what you have. And the fact that it’s still supported is pretty incredible.
 

Holescreek

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#13
A long time ago I made a spider for my lathe for this type of thing. It takes a very large bearing and some cold rolled steel

steady003-vi.jpg

steady002-vi.jpg

The cage around the bearing has set screws in the middle of the bearing pockets to give some adjustment to place the bearing on the center of the spindle axis. I've only had to reset the center once after I took the frame apart to turn the bearing around 180 degrees. The four screws on the aluminum collar take care of centering your project metal.

Here you can see it in use holding material for my form1 can:

20170831_114902-vi.jpg

It also works very well for holding long barrels steady at the end for chambering. No friction, excess material strength needed.
 
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Silverbullet

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#14
There have been several built on YouTube , some by hobbiest and others professional . But the heavier the steady the better. Ill add some names to look at. Nic C Colyer is in the end stages of a pretty good build on one. If I remember Oxtool did one awhile ago.
Don't they usually use aluminum for the baffles and the tube for silencers??
 
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Investigator

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#15
I'd keep the Logan unless she is very tired over any new shiny machine. But, that's my old iron preference.
Making one is a definite option. Just gotta find the best combination.
Did you see this post. Possibly more than you want to pay. However, there is more there than just the steady!!
Don't know the seller. Have not seen the parts...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/LOGAN-12-i...654365?hash=item4b3751ca9d:g:2GsAAOSw38BaaObL

Daryl
MN
Thanks, I did see that. I already have the 5c collet parts for the lathe. Overall I got a tremendous deal on the Logan and what came with it. She's in pretty fair to good shape, got some backlash in the dials but that is easy enough to work around. with the lack of a steady or a tail stock, other than the turret, I have been unable to make a test bar to see just what she is capable off. But so far the tolerance I can hold is worse than what the lathe will do.

Personal question if you don't mind, it looks from your avatar you are a firefighter. Full time? part time? where at? I've been 25 years with Mesquite FD outside Dallas Texas, now an Arson Investigator there.
 

Uglydog

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#16
18years paid on call FF Dayton MN. ~300calls/year.
Was training officer for 16 of those.
Long time Paramedic for a metro EMS agency and retired Paramedic Instructor (17years teaching).
Still work EMS 2times week for small rural service.
Looking forward to not renewing anything!
I've seen enough... I'm guessing you understand.

Daryl
MN
 

Silverbullet

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#17
You can buy a used one near your size and machine a base to your ways . I've been planning on doing it for my logan.
 

Nogoingback

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#18
There's a Logan 12" steady rest on eBay right now.
 

wa5cab

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#20
Another alternative would be to acquire a tailstock. And yet another would be to buy a live center and replace the probably either 2MT or 3MT arbor with a straight one that fits the turret. As the turret does not have a ram, be sure that the arbor is long enough not to restrict the carriage from getting close enough to the end of the work piece
 

Alittlerusty

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#21
As silverbullet said u can get one slightly smaller and add a base plate to get it up to center.
 

Investigator

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#22
I'm wondering.....rather than ebay, I found that grizzly sells the entire steady rest assembly for their 8, 9, 10 and 11 inch lathes for around 100 bucks. Just wondering if buying one and using an adapter plate on bottom would be a lower cost, but workable option.
 

LEEQ

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#23
for the money it sounds like a good place to start, you might need a mill to fit the adapter plate. If you wanted to go forward with your project while you hunt rests and tailstocks, you might consider a design with baffles made one at a time. Assuming of course that the design change is all legal.
 

joe from N.Y.

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#24
Maybe a brother in here living nearby can lend you the before a short term use.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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#25
I'm wondering.....rather than ebay, I found that grizzly sells the entire steady rest assembly for their 8, 9, 10 and 11 inch lathes for around 100 bucks. Just wondering if buying one and using an adapter plate on bottom would be a lower cost, but workable option.
You certainly could do that. If I recall correctly, some of the older Logans used the same steady rest for both the 10" and 11" machines, with the steady rest for the 11" having a spacer beneath it. I believe the 12" machines used a different steady rest that was both larger in diameter and built heavier.

There also used to be a seller on eBay that sold generic steady rests in various sizes, I don't know if those are still available or not.
 
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cg285

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#26
here is a kit. http://www.statecollegecentral.com/metallathe/MLA-9.html
i have one partially finished when i lucked out and found a new one on ebay for my clausing metosa.
if you like i could sell you mine assuming i can find it
(forgot to hit the post button yesterday so someone beat me to it)
 

ThunderDog

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#27
A long time ago I made a spider for my lathe for this type of thing. It takes a very large bearing and some cold rolled steel

View attachment 257445

View attachment 257446

The cage around the bearing has set screws in the middle of the bearing pockets to give some adjustment to place the bearing on the center of the spindle axis. I've only had to reset the center once after I took the frame apart to turn the bearing around 180 degrees. The four screws on the aluminum collar take care of centering your project metal.

Here you can see it in use holding material for my form1 can:

View attachment 257447

It also works very well for holding long barrels steady at the end for chambering. No friction, excess material strength needed.
Nice, I could only wonder the price of that bearing purchased brand new.
 

Holescreek

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#28
Nice, I could only wonder the price of that bearing purchased brand new.
I looked it up once, >$400. I paid $25. I have another large bearing (not near as large) I picked up at a flea market for $5 that I'm going to use to make a spider for my Clausing lathe. The only trick to making these is getting the bearing ID on center with the spindle axis. With the adjustment screws in the frame it's a cinch.
 

Downunder Bob

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#29
I'm very frustrated, somewhat with my machine but mostly with me. The short version is I need a steady rest but cant find one.

My 2537 12" turret lathe has been making chips for a while now. I'm not by any stretch of the imagination a machinist, but I have been able to make what I have needed so for. All of my projects have been small. I've made bushings and and a few odd parts here and there. This is just me in my shop at home for fun.
But I have a big project to work on for myself. I have been planning on making a few suppressors for my rifles. I've got all the legalities covered and all is on the up and up.

The issue is I have some 4140 round bar about 14" long to make the baffles out of. Baffles will be 60* cones to fit inside a 1.5"ID tube. The best, as I understand it, way to make them is chuck the bar up, and use a steady rest to support it while I work a baffle at a time on the far end. So that means I need a steady which didn't come with the lathe.

Necessity is a mother, so I make a steady.........The first version was a hexagon shape about 10" diameter. I'm sure you can already see the problem. I made it from .5x.750" bar stock, welded, threaded 120* apart. It looked good, but when I put it on and turned the machine by hand, there was so much flex in the fingers I was afraid to even turn the machine on. So back to the drawing board.

The second steady was made from wood. I used 3 layers of 3/4" birch glued and screwed together. I had a 4" hole in the center and again fingers at 120* apart. The fingers were 1/2-13 bolts which I turned and tipped with brass. Unfortunatly there is too much movement in the wood itself I guess. As I start to take light cuts on the surface, it works loose and starts flexing. I have been watching Ebay and can't find a Logan Steady rest and dont know if anything else will fit.

I'm really disappointed in my self and in the project so far. So much so I had to just leave the shop. As bad as it sounds I am considering selling the Logan and getting a new import lathe that comes with a steady and tail stock, which I also don't have and would like to have. Right now my project is stopped and I can't do anything about it.

I just wanted to try to share the weight on my shoulders, confession being good for the soul and all, and share my tale of woe.
Hi, from your description (no pic provided) I think your first attempt at building a steady rest was on the right track, you just need to use heavier material to get the rigidity, as far as the frame shape it's not really important. Round or hexagonal are the most common, and either will work well.

With the top part hinging open you have to make sure that it clamps down tight without any movement, also the base needs to be very rigid, and a good fit to the lathe bed, no rocking allowed.. The other area of concern is the adjustable fingers need to be well guided, don't just rely on the threads to give rigidity here but set the fingers into square or round guides.

The tips of the fingers are traditionally brass or bronze but there appears to be a newish trend to using small ball races, but they must be of good quality, or they will break down quickly. Some people like them, some don't. Apparantly they can mark soft materials,

I've only ever used brass or bronze tips, and have never had a problem. I have also heard of hardwood tips being used, I imagine you could also use some of the hard engineering plastics, some of them have very low coeff. of friction,and are quite tough.

There are anumber of well documented builds on this site, have a look at them and go for it. BTW I would not be keen to sell the Logan if it's in fair to good condition, any old iron from USA, Australia, UK, Europe, in fair condition is a better machine than most of the asian imports. But they are scarcer than rockinh horse sh*t down here, so I had to go for an import, just had to make sure I got the best I could.

And I will have to make a steady for it, as the one that came with it only takes up to 3.5 inch so I'm going to make one that will take up to 6" which will just clear my cross slide. But that is probably a year away yet, more important things to first.


As for your desire for a tail stock you should be able to use your turret as a tailstock, I've seen that done, you can buy live centres on MT shafts as well as parallel shafts.

Good luck on all fronts.
 

fast freddie

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#30
On my 12 inch clausing i bought one for a different lathe off ebay and adapted the mounting to fit and it works good
 
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