Ive been looking at this upgrade from my old HF 7-10, Has anyone used or have any comments on this lathe? I like the change gears and all the extras that it comes with but how is it as far as fit and finish? I know all need to be tweeked some and thats not a problem just saying if someone has one would love to hear your thoughts ED
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Grizzly G4000
- Thread starter edowens
- Start date
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2012
- Messages
- 924
I have had the equivalent Enco lathe and found it to be less then optimal machine for an all-around lathe.
it has many shotcomings which many people found work arounds for (compound ring is subpar, no reverse feed, apron feed bracket subpar and requires mods otherwise you'll be looking at replacing feed gears every once in a while). I personally sold it and got a better machine for an all around lathe.
If you are willing to invest in all the mods for it - it can be made to work just fine. Another good use for it is if you have a dedicated job that you would like to assign to a cost effective machine (although you still may have to fabricate some of the mods depending on the job it is purchased for).
unless for the above plan (dedicated machine for low cost), I would avoid the 9x19/9x20 range of machines. they are made with large enough envelope that would make you think they can handle the work, but they are still made with 7x grade specs.
just my $.02 - many others have done good work with those (mostly after moding them)
it has many shotcomings which many people found work arounds for (compound ring is subpar, no reverse feed, apron feed bracket subpar and requires mods otherwise you'll be looking at replacing feed gears every once in a while). I personally sold it and got a better machine for an all around lathe.
If you are willing to invest in all the mods for it - it can be made to work just fine. Another good use for it is if you have a dedicated job that you would like to assign to a cost effective machine (although you still may have to fabricate some of the mods depending on the job it is purchased for).
unless for the above plan (dedicated machine for low cost), I would avoid the 9x19/9x20 range of machines. they are made with large enough envelope that would make you think they can handle the work, but they are still made with 7x grade specs.
just my $.02 - many others have done good work with those (mostly after moding them)
- Joined
- Sep 25, 2012
- Messages
- 302
That sounds like some good future advice for anyone looking to upgrade from the 7x sizes. I never really have had a need to think about it myself but there are lots of 7"X10" owners out there. It looks like you can buy the G0602 10" x22" with allot more options for just a little more. As an alternative I see where people are very happy with the Lathemaster 9"X30" but the G0602 looks like a better deal with the 1" bore.
The more I look at it for $200 more the G0602 is a way better lathe than the G4000. MT3 tailstock, 1" bore and 160# more metal for the money.
The more I look at it for $200 more the G0602 is a way better lathe than the G4000. MT3 tailstock, 1" bore and 160# more metal for the money.
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2013
- Messages
- 4,406
First off, I own a G4000, and have done a number of the "tweaks" that make it more useful/reliable/rigid. This has included changing to a "4-bolt compound" fastening system (from LMS), adding a QCTP, and fabricating a "reverse tumbler" to allow turning left-hand threads. Future mods will likely include a variable speed motor (either DC or 3 phase) and installing the new carriage lock (bike seat quick release) that I bought recently. There's a good Yahoo group (9x20Lathe) that's loaded with tips and tricks.
Looking at this thread got me interested in the G0602 (and its 3 phase cousin, the G0752). I downloaded the manual, read it carefully, and came up with the following comparisons to the G4000. Some of the items might be a bit obscure for anybody that's not familiar with the G4000, but I'll be glad to answer questions as they come up.
1. There's no "independent" way to get threading and power feed. On the G4000, there are two (sometimes poorly) interlocked levers on the apron, which either engage the half-nuts for threading or couple the rotating leadscrew to the carriage rack. The G0602 does not have the latter feature. You have to do a pseudo-”very fine thread” setup on the change gears to get power feed. Not very convenient, as you need to swap three gears to get a metric thread, two gears and reposition of a third to get inch threads.
2. As with the G4000, there is *no* provision for LH threading on the G0602.
3. The “final leadscrew drive” of the G4000 has a manually oiled semi-open gearbox with 9 gears, selected by sliding a pin-equipped lever sideways (sometimes easier than others). The G0602 has an oil filled gear box with two 3-speed selector knobs. This looks to be a superior design.
4. The top of the compound slide on the G0602 has a large T-slot, which makes it *much* easier to mount a QCTP than on the G4000, which has a pressed-in M8 stud. This T-slot makes the compound just a bit taller, which is probably one of the major reasons the G0602 has a larger swing (advertised as 10”, but specified as 9 5/8” in the manual) than the G4000 (advertised as 9”, specified as 8 3/4” in the manual). Unfortunately, both the G0602 and the G4000 use the notorious “2-bolt compound” angle adjusting ring, one of the major points of non-rigidity with the G4000. But unlike the G4000 the G0602 does *not* have T-slots atop the cross slide. So adding a “4-bolt compound” retrofit would not be anywhere near as simple.
5. Both the G4000 and the G0602 spindle speeds are based on which pulleys are used. Both have 6 speeds. The G0602 has the advantage of using a heftier (3/8”) V-belt than the G4000 (5m). But it has two disadvantages. First off, the G0602 uses two different V-belts, depending on which speed is to be set up. Secondly, the tensioner only operates with one of the belts. As far as I can tell, there’s no way to release tension when installing or adjusting the other belt.
6. As others have notes, the G0602 wins hands-down in the spindle and chuck department. Spindle bore is larger, spindle nose threads are more “standard” (1 3/4” x 8tpi) than on the G4000 (39x4mm). Spindle has MT4 taper, tailstock MT3 (vs MT3-MT2 on the G4000). The G0602 has a chuck retainer on the spindle. And finally, the G0602 comes with a “genuine” 4-jaw chuck, unlike the “glorified faceplate” you get with the G4000.
7. Both lathes have a somewhat functional carriage lock (socket-head screw on top, which loves to get clogged with swarf), and the G0602 includes a sort-of cross slide lock. This may well be OK, but being a setscrew, you’ll have to keep yet another the allen wrench handy.
My “bottom line” opinion is that, while G0602’s features are well worth the $200 price bump, this lathe will disappoint anybody who expects it to be the “next step up.” It still requires some tweaks and mods to make it more rigid and functional. YMMV!
PS - I’d be willing to bet that Grizzly plans to phase out the G4000 as soon as their stock runs out.
- John Herrmann
Looking at this thread got me interested in the G0602 (and its 3 phase cousin, the G0752). I downloaded the manual, read it carefully, and came up with the following comparisons to the G4000. Some of the items might be a bit obscure for anybody that's not familiar with the G4000, but I'll be glad to answer questions as they come up.
1. There's no "independent" way to get threading and power feed. On the G4000, there are two (sometimes poorly) interlocked levers on the apron, which either engage the half-nuts for threading or couple the rotating leadscrew to the carriage rack. The G0602 does not have the latter feature. You have to do a pseudo-”very fine thread” setup on the change gears to get power feed. Not very convenient, as you need to swap three gears to get a metric thread, two gears and reposition of a third to get inch threads.
2. As with the G4000, there is *no* provision for LH threading on the G0602.
3. The “final leadscrew drive” of the G4000 has a manually oiled semi-open gearbox with 9 gears, selected by sliding a pin-equipped lever sideways (sometimes easier than others). The G0602 has an oil filled gear box with two 3-speed selector knobs. This looks to be a superior design.
4. The top of the compound slide on the G0602 has a large T-slot, which makes it *much* easier to mount a QCTP than on the G4000, which has a pressed-in M8 stud. This T-slot makes the compound just a bit taller, which is probably one of the major reasons the G0602 has a larger swing (advertised as 10”, but specified as 9 5/8” in the manual) than the G4000 (advertised as 9”, specified as 8 3/4” in the manual). Unfortunately, both the G0602 and the G4000 use the notorious “2-bolt compound” angle adjusting ring, one of the major points of non-rigidity with the G4000. But unlike the G4000 the G0602 does *not* have T-slots atop the cross slide. So adding a “4-bolt compound” retrofit would not be anywhere near as simple.
5. Both the G4000 and the G0602 spindle speeds are based on which pulleys are used. Both have 6 speeds. The G0602 has the advantage of using a heftier (3/8”) V-belt than the G4000 (5m). But it has two disadvantages. First off, the G0602 uses two different V-belts, depending on which speed is to be set up. Secondly, the tensioner only operates with one of the belts. As far as I can tell, there’s no way to release tension when installing or adjusting the other belt.
6. As others have notes, the G0602 wins hands-down in the spindle and chuck department. Spindle bore is larger, spindle nose threads are more “standard” (1 3/4” x 8tpi) than on the G4000 (39x4mm). Spindle has MT4 taper, tailstock MT3 (vs MT3-MT2 on the G4000). The G0602 has a chuck retainer on the spindle. And finally, the G0602 comes with a “genuine” 4-jaw chuck, unlike the “glorified faceplate” you get with the G4000.
7. Both lathes have a somewhat functional carriage lock (socket-head screw on top, which loves to get clogged with swarf), and the G0602 includes a sort-of cross slide lock. This may well be OK, but being a setscrew, you’ll have to keep yet another the allen wrench handy.
My “bottom line” opinion is that, while G0602’s features are well worth the $200 price bump, this lathe will disappoint anybody who expects it to be the “next step up.” It still requires some tweaks and mods to make it more rigid and functional. YMMV!
PS - I’d be willing to bet that Grizzly plans to phase out the G4000 as soon as their stock runs out.
- John Herrmann
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2011
- Messages
- 581
I've had a G4000 since 1995 and can say all of the aforementioned is true. It does require a few tweaks and I would think if you could find a used one for half the price or less of a new one then go for it. While it is a very capable little machine and I also have a G9972, I would also look at some of the other models out there today if I were to buy new right now.
It really depends on what a person's goals are. Personally I liked the challenge of taking an okay unit and working on it to be a really good machine, but in today's busy environment I do not have as much time to tinker/tweak something as I would like.
Good Luck no matter what your choice is and do all the research you can first and then decide!
It really depends on what a person's goals are. Personally I liked the challenge of taking an okay unit and working on it to be a really good machine, but in today's busy environment I do not have as much time to tinker/tweak something as I would like.
Good Luck no matter what your choice is and do all the research you can first and then decide!
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2013
- Messages
- 4,406
Just saw this in the 9x20Lathe Yahoo group forum ... an article about adding a 4-bolt (6-bolt?) compound mount to a G0602:
http://www.projectsinmetal.com/foru...quare-four-bolt-compound-mount-for-the-g0602/
http://www.projectsinmetal.com/foru...quare-four-bolt-compound-mount-for-the-g0602/
- Joined
- Sep 24, 2010
- Messages
- 3,096
I found one used a while back and bought it. The machines from Enco, HF and others are all the same so the tweaks and mods are all the same too. The fellow I am buying mine from has already installed a QCTP and done some of the easier mods so it will just be a matter of finding the tings I want to correct and go from there. As far as being a sub-par machine, it is true that they do leave a bit to be desired, but they are also not a 6 thousand dollar lathe either. All things considered in making a move up from the venerable 7X10 should be a good move indeed. I also have a 7X10 and the increased work envelope will really compliment the small stuff I do, without spending the national debt to get there. Tooling is where I am at now, and I have been studying what is available and what I can save a bit on here and there. I avoid CDCO and Shars (they are the same, just different internet sites is all) and I also try to avoid the bottom dollar imported from india and china items too. I tend to look for mid priced items from Taiwan and higher mid priced stuff from India so that I can get the quality I need to get the job done. Grizzly, Bolton, Enco and LMS are the main suppliers I try to stick with and I tend to use HSS tooling because the lack of rigidity and horse power make it difficult to exploit the faster and deeper cuts that can be obtained with indexable carbide tooling. There are some things that a good holder and some quality bits will help with, but the vast majority of what I do is Aluminum, mild, and Brass so I dont really need a whole lot of carbide anyway. So if you find one at a reasonable price in good condition I would not hesitate to go ahead and get the machine. They are just like the rest, a little TLC works wonders and they can be tweaked into being very capable little performers. Just my .02 worth and thoughts.....
Bob