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[4]

I got me one of these! HASLER SPEED INDICATOR

January Project of the Month [3]
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Bob Korves

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#31
Old car speedometers could be accurate, if they tried. Witness the police certified units. But most were made to budget with aesthetics a primary factor. It's hard to be accurate when your entire range is covered in 60-90 degrees of sweep.

I'll put up a picture of the tach I found in the barn this evening. Accurate or not, it is an impressive piece.
Auto speedometers are inherently inaccurate. They rely on the tire diameter being constant, which it never is. Also, a new set of tires will be a different diameter. Then they ran it through a cable to a drum with a magnetic follower, which has no inherent accuracy. Yes, they were calibrated, and still are, but they become inaccurate immediately, the calibration is just a useful talking point in court.
 

woodchucker

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#32
Anyone know where I can buy some of the reflective tape. All of my stickers that can with mine lost their glue. I did get a White paint stick to work, but would rather have the stick on reflective tape.
Go get Aluminum Tape in the HVAC area in the HD, or LOWES. Used for sealing insulated air ducts.
I use it for a lot of things. It's durable, reflective, and hold tenaciously, but can be peeled because it's AL, not paper
 

Finster

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#33
Well, I just got this thing in the mail. It's SUPER NICE! :D I mean, it doesn't hardly look like it has ever been used. The case doesn't even have a scuff on it and the felt lining is perfect. The device doesn't have a scratch and the rubber wheels are even in great shape! I would have to say that this is pretty much mint! I got all excited, read the instructions, ran out to the shop, chucked up a piece of round bar and tried it out. It worked flawlessly! :grin big: Now I don't know how accurate it is. I'll have to compare it to another device or something known but so far I'm really happy with it. It's super simple to use also. Now my only question is, it has a small oil hole on the shaft. I'm wondering what type of oil to use? Maybe just a drop of 3 in 1 ?
 

Tony Wells

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#34
What is the name of the app? I'll download it and compare it to this instrument.
It's just called "Strobe Tachometer". I run it on an old iPhone. It was free in the app store.
 

rgray

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#35
Now my only question is, it has a small oil hole on the shaft. I'm wondering what type of oil to use? Maybe just a drop of 3 in 1 ?
My vote would be spindle oil. Like Mobil velocite #6 . But that's cause I have it for the mill and cylindrical grinder. Very thin.
 

grzdomagala

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#36
Update. Just checked the meter with LED driven from impuls generator - at 50Hz it shows 2960rpm and at 500Hz 29768rpm. Quite accurate. I also tested it at 6.5V supply voltage (dead battery simulation) - still the same, correct values. Looks like my diy meter is the bad one.
Quite impressive for 10$ meter...

Wysłane z mojego GT-N7100 przy użyciu Tapatalka
 

RandyWilson

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#37
Auto speedometers are inherently inaccurate. They rely on the tire diameter being constant, which it never is. Also, a new set of tires will be a different diameter. Then they ran it through a cable to a drum with a magnetic follower, which has no inherent accuracy. Yes, they were calibrated, and still are, but they become inaccurate immediately, the calibration is just a useful talking point in court.

I was talking about the potential of the instrument itself. Yes, the drive mechanism was suspect. Still is.

This is the one I found in the barn, ex Father in law. It is truely a tachometer; readings in real time. IMAG0380.jpg
 

Finster

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#39
Well, I chucked up a piece of round stock on the lathe and drilled a center hole for testing this. The free app I downloaded on the phone was placing surface speed of the .750 round bar at 580 rpm. My antique Swiss timepiece was put in the center hole and measured 590 rpm. Now I don't know the math to figure it out (I'm sure someone here does) but I do know that the center will be spinning faster. That being said, it seems pretty good to me and as accurate as I need. If anyone can figure out the equation and see if they match, I would be interested, just for kicks. All in all, I think I scored pretty good. However, I hope it doesn't break, I doubt anyone could fix it and I believe the company finally went out of business in the 80's Not to big of a deal. I'll probably check all my belt settings on my machines, write it all down and it will sit in the drawer for the most part. Nice to have though.
 

Finster

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#41
RPM is RPM, no matter the diameter. You have agreement within 2%, which I would think is close enough for spindle speeds.
Why is that not sounding correct? I'm not arguing, just confused. I'll have to think about this for awhile. The strobe, by nature, is checking the mark on the outside of the bar. So, in essence it is actually checking surface speed, correct? The other is checking the center of the bar or "the shaft" of say a motor. Why do I think they should not be the same? By the way, I flunked algebra more than once.
 

Tony Wells

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#42
The timing mark is going to appear in the strobe just once per revolution, no matter what size the OD is. It doesn't take any longer to swing around the axis of rotation no matter what size it is. I think you are trying to integrate surface speed into this, but that is another thing altogether. That is diameter dependent. But put that out of your thinking on this one. 1 inch, 100 inches or 100 miles......how long it takes to complete a single rotation is the basis for how this works. The actual time it takes for that revolution does affect surface speed, but not RPM.
 

Finster

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#43
The timing mark is going to appear in the strobe just once per revolution, no matter what size the OD is. It doesn't take any longer to swing around the axis of rotation no matter what size it is. I think you are trying to integrate surface speed into this, but that is another thing altogether. That is diameter dependent. But put that out of your thinking on this one. 1 inch, 100 inches or 100 miles......how long it takes to complete a single rotation is the basis for how this works. The actual time it takes for that revolution does affect surface speed, but not RPM.
OK that helped and I agree. But now I have a different problem. (look at the picture of my first post) I use one of the little wheels and put it on the surface. My RPM is way off, not even close, off by more than a thousand. I put the pointed center in, take a reading in the center drill hole and it's dead nuts. Why is that?
 

RandyWilson

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#44
By using the rubber wheel against the surface, you are incorporating surface speed into the equation. The ratio would be your stock diameter divided by the wheel diameter. A 1/4" rubber wheel against a 3/4" piece of stock will give a reading three times faster than expected.
 

Finster

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#45
By using the rubber wheel against the surface, you are incorporating surface speed into the equation. The ratio would be your stock diameter divided by the wheel diameter. A 1/4" rubber wheel against a 3/4" piece of stock will give a reading three times faster than expected.
Humph. Learned something new. Retaining it will be the problem. ;)
 

benmychree

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#49
Interesting instrument. I would guess that it functions much like the old mechanical speedometers in cars. The spindle is attached to a rotating magnet and the magnet creates eddy currents which create a force that works against a clock spring. The faster the rotation the greater the force and the greater the deflection.

As I recall, the mechanical speedometers were notoriously inaccurate. Hopefully, the Hasler indicator doesn't suffer from the same problems.
Actually, this type of device operates by counting turns on the dial in a given period of time; I have a similar device and that is how it works. Read the instructions on the card on the back of the case, it spells out the operating mode. When you engage the button, you can hear the clock mechanism inside ticking; when it stops ticking, it disengages a clutch on the input shaft.
 

ch2co

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#50
My only problem with the el cheapo tach I got off of eBay is that it uses a 9 volt battery. I hate 9 volt batteries. My tach has a habit of not turning itself off
and 9 volt batteries are just too darn expensive to keep replacing every time I don't bother to turn it off.:guilty: Otherwise that little guy is my goto tach.
The mechanical tach is beautiful to behold, but is difficult to use for determining the speed of your chuck for instance. I really like my Machtach
on my lathe. All three of my tachometers read within a couple of percent of each other.
 

Bob Korves

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#51
I have lots of things that take batteries, but I leave the batteries out of them until I am ready to use them, and then remove the batteries immediately afterward -- with a few exceptions. A flashlight for when the power goes off, a couple wall clocks, and my daily user HF digital calipers.
 

ch2co

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#52
I just pulled my old mechanical tach out from under a pile of more often used tools, and it is a Misawa Seiki brand, Japanese. Its from the mid 60's.
Doesn't need any instructions since even I figured it out how to run it, although the instructions are clearly printed in the top of the box, if you read
Japanese. Although the photo makes it look round, the outer edge is polygonal just like Finster's Hasler. See below:

And to answer to Bob, I try to remember to take the batteries out, but being senile as I am, (just ask the wife) I sometimes forgets.
There's nothing worse than to open a battery compartment and find it filled with white crystalline powder and the contacts all
chewed up.:(
 

Attachments

Dave 41

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#53
QUOTE="RJSakowski, post: 478973, member: 36675"]And then it was sent on to Japan and the Japanese tapped the hole.[/QUOTE]
The way I heard it: The Swiss sent it back to the Germans who proclaimed themselves the winner of the competition since the Swiss returned the wire unchanged. The Swiss replied that the Germans were wrong, and they would have known that if they had examined the wire more closely. The Swiss cut the wire in two, and turned the end of one piece down and threaded it. The remaining half was bored and internally threaded, and the two pieces were screwed together.
 

uncle harry

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#54
QUOTE="RJSakowski, post: 478973, member: 36675"]And then it was sent on to Japan and the Japanese tapped the hole.
The way I heard it: The Swiss sent it back to the Germans who proclaimed themselves the winner of the competition since the Swiss returned the wire unchanged. The Swiss replied that the Germans were wrong, and they would have known that if they had examined the wire more closely. The Swiss cut the wire in two, and turned the end of one piece down and threaded it. The remaining half was bored and internally threaded, and the two pieces were screwed together.[/QUOTE]

I've heard the first version of this series of micro machining, but threading and tapping at that level might just require some historical investigation.
 

benmychree

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#55
Well, I chucked up a piece of round stock on the lathe and drilled a center hole for testing this. The free app I downloaded on the phone was placing surface speed of the .750 round bar at 580 rpm. My antique Swiss timepiece was put in the center hole and measured 590 rpm. Now I don't know the math to figure it out (I'm sure someone here does) but I do know that the center will be spinning faster. That being said, it seems pretty good to me and as accurate as I need. If anyone can figure out the equation and see if they match, I would be interested, just for kicks. All in all, I think I scored pretty good. However, I hope it doesn't break, I doubt anyone could fix it and I believe the company finally went out of business in the 80's Not to big of a deal. I'll probably check all my belt settings on my machines, write it all down and it will sit in the drawer for the most part. Nice to have though.
RPM equals cutting speed times 4 divided by the diameter of the moving part; this is not exact, but it was what I was taught in my high school machine shop class and can be easily done in your head. Cutting speed (in feet per minute) for soft steel is 100, alloy steel maybe 60, brass maybe 300, etc. This is from school shop, as I said, but that was 1963 ---- easiest thing is to get a slide rule cutting speed calculator; all the carbide tool companies gave them away back in the day, you can find them on E Bay; some are better for lathe work, some for milling, but they all will tell you what RPM to use if you know an acceptable speed in feet per minute.
 

fixit

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#58
Ordered one , $7. and change free shipping, hope it comes with reflective tapes x3
Thanks

You can also use WHITE CHALK to mark the shaft. If you need to spot a shaft or whatever just put a chalk mark on it. I used it just yesterday to check the TAC on a tractor.

fixit
 

Buffalo20

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#59
I have one of the Chinese optical tachs, I bought it about 10 years ago from Meter-Depot, for about $20 shipped. I have 2 tools with optical encoders, that read the spindle rpm, the tach reads exactly the same rpm. I have permanent pieces of silver tape on all of the spindles, covered by a small piece of clear packing tape. It keeps the reflective tape in place and doesn't effect the reading. I also have a Stewart-Warner direct contact tach, the resolution of the dial is poor, it will get the rpm, within 20-25 rpm.

I have a few machines where I changed pulleys/sheaves to get the rpms I wanted, I then made a speed chart for all of the belt positions.
 
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