Info on a K. O. Lee Surface Grinder

[tjb]

I am looking at an older model S718H K. O. Lee surface grinder that has had very light use and appears to be in excellent condition. It includes a 6" x 18" magnetic chuck, some additional wheels, and all peripherals. I'm very interested in it, but I've been cautioned against that manufacturer. Evidently, since they were sold to LeBlond, parts are either nearly impossible to get and/or prohibitively expensive. (As an example, I saw a post in another forum where a guy bought one but didn't get the spanner wrench with it. LeBlond wanted a few hundred dollars for one!) My use would be strictly light-duty hobby applications, but the last thing I want to do is take advantage of what appears to be a 'good deal' that ends up costing more than the machine is worth.

Any counsel on what to look for or candid opinions regarding roll-the-dice or keep-looking?

Regards,
Terry

 

[Cadillac]

From my experience you will run into parts availability for ANY old equipment. I don’t know if k.o. Lee is still in business. Most of the parts are probably standard gears and bearings so with a cross reference shouldn’t be hard to find. You don’t need a brand specific wrench for hubs. Sopko is probably the manufacturer and they can be had easily on eBay 20 dollar range.
I would inspect all the moving parts of condition and hopefully run to check spindle and operation.

 

[tjb]

From my experience you will run into parts availability for ANY old equipment. I don’t know if k.o. Lee is still in business. Most of the parts are probably standard gears and bearings so with a cross reference shouldn’t be hard to find. You don’t need a brand specific wrench for hubs. Sopko is probably the manufacturer and they can be had easily on eBay 20 dollar range.
I would inspect all the moving parts of condition and hopefully run to check spindle and operation.

Thanks.

What I've learned is that K. O. Lee is indeed still in business but as a subsidiary of LeBlond. Yeah, the guy's solution on the spanner wrench was to just buy a new generic model (in the $20-ish range), which worked fine. That was actually easier than simply making one.

Evidently, there are at least some non-standard parts that potentially could be a problem. I have read some nightmares purchasers have encountered trying to track down things like that. (Again, 'been there/done that' on a Harrison M300 lathe and don't want to go through that again.) Frankly, I wouldn't even give this machine a passing thought if it didn't appear to be in pristine condition. Still cautious, though.

Curious if anyone has some hands-on knowledge of this model and can suggest specifics to examine, or what I can expect might be a significant wear-item in the future.

Thanks again for your helpful reply.

Regards,
Terry

 

[Bob Korves]

Orphan equipment is the status quo for hobbyists. You just need to make sure there are no deal breakers before purchase (as with any machine), then tune, clean, and lube it, and keep it that way. That, along with careful use, will easily make it last the rest of our days in a home shop, turning out nice parts and keeping us happy. K.O. Lee made very nice machines. A good spindle is the top priority to buying a useful used surface grinder, the rest can be repaired or rehabbed.

 

[tjb]

Orphan equipment is the status quo for hobbyists. You just need to make sure there are no deal breakers before purchase (as with any machine), then tune, clean, and lube it, and keep it that way. That, along with careful use, will easily make it last the rest of our days in a home shop, turning out nice parts and keeping us happy. K.O. Lee made very nice machines. A good spindle is the top priority to buying a useful used surface grinder, the rest can be repaired or rehabbed.

Thanks, Bob, for your typically informative reply.

Novice question: How do I go about determining if the spindle is good?

Regards,
Terry

 

[Cadillac]

Spin by hand first it should be smooth. If unit has been sitting I would freewheel by hand for a min then turn on the power. Try and distribute grease if possible. If spindle is whining or worse could be a relube or new bearings. You can pull the table off very easily to check for visible wear on ways and condition of leadscrew. Take the spindle head Assy and try rocking to see if way are worn on head ways. Try pushing the head up after lowering a turn or two to see if there’s play in head Leadscrew. Check cables or rack for table traverse for wear. Look at overall appearance all chip up covered in grinding dust they didn’t care for it to good. Paint pristine and oil stains coming from the way areas and looks good most likely they cared for their tools. It’s all a crap shoot unless they let you grind a large part and measure it, and let you go through everything till you satisfied. Which would be nice but not likely.

 

[tjb]

Spin by hand first it should be smooth. If unit has been sitting I would freewheel by hand for a min then turn on the power. Try and distribute grease if possible. If spindle is whining or worse could be a relube or new bearings. You can pull the table off very easily to check for visible wear on ways and condition of leadscrew. Take the spindle head Assy and try rocking to see if way are worn on head ways. Try pushing the head up after lowering a turn or two to see if there’s play in head Leadscrew. Check cables or rack for table traverse for wear. Look at overall appearance all chip up covered in grinding dust they didn’t care for it to good. Paint pristine and oil stains coming from the way areas and looks good most likely they cared for their tools. It’s all a crap shoot unless they let you grind a large part and measure it, and let you go through everything till you satisfied. Which would be nice but not likely.

Thanks, Cadillac.

The machine passes the visual 'paint and oil' test. The unit is enticing from photos, and I've seen a video of it running under power (not grinding - just running). Looks and sounds good and everything works as it should, but that's not as obvious as an on-sight examination. We're in the tire-kicking stage, but I suspect I'll be taking a trip to see it. It's about a three-hour drive so not too bad, but not close enough to just drop by, either. If I end up going there, I'm going to take a printout of your recommendations with me.

Thanks again for your help.

Regards,
Terry

 

[Bob Korves]

Thanks, Bob, for your typically informative reply.

Novice question: How do I go about determining if the spindle is good?

Regards,
Terry

When you get there, hopefully the spindle will be cold and has sat a few days at least. Turn it over very slowly and gently, like you are a safe cracker. Feel for grit, bumps, and anything other than dead smooth. Move the spindle up and down and in and out, checking very carefully for play. Push and pull the spindle while turning it, feeling for any changes. If that seems OK, put a wheel on it if there isn't one, and start it up. You want the spindle itself to be running quietly and smoothly. Let it warm up for at least 10 minutes, listening for any changes. If all is well, do some test cuts on hardened and mild steel stock, can be small, but should be long enough to look for wheel hop and other loose spindle bearing issues. You will also be feeling how the table feels as it is moved.

Most everything on a surface grinder is fixable, but rebuilding the spindle can easily cost more than the entire machine is worth. Any doubts, just walk away...

 

[tjb]

When you get there, hopefully the spindle will be cold and has sat a few days at least. Turn it over very slowly and gently, like you are a safe cracker. Feel for grit, bumps, and anything other than dead smooth. Move the spindle up and down and in and out, checking very carefully for play. Push and pull the spindle while turning it, feeling for any changes. If that seems OK, put a wheel on it if there isn't one, and start it up. You want the spindle itself to be running quietly and smoothly. Let it warm up for at least 10 minutes, listening for any changes. If all is well, do some test cuts on hardened and mild steel stock, can be small, but should be long enough to look for wheel hop and other loose spindle bearing issues. You will also be feeling how the table feels as it is moved.

Most everything on a surface grinder is fixable, but rebuilding the spindle can easily cost more than the entire machine is worth. Any doubts, just walk away...

Thanks, Bob.

Between yours and Cadillac's responses, and the information I've received from the seller, I'm getting the impression that this is one worth looking at. Hopefully, we'll be able to see how it looks up close and personal. Don't know when that will happen, but I'll keep you guys posted.

Regards and thanks again,
Terry

 

[Bob Korves]

If you decide to buy it, take the table off before loading it up. The table on many/most surface grinders lifts right off, the table weight is about 100 pounds on my B&S model 2L 6x18. Also crank the head up, put some wood blocks under it, and then back off the lead screw until all the weigh is off of the the lead screw. Bouncing on the road can kill table bearings and the spindle lift lead screw. The table can also depart the machine while transporting it. Some tables are driven with a cable, steel band, or similar, which will need to be disconnected to take the table off. My 2L runs on a rack and pinion gear under the table, which lifts right off. If there are ball or roller bearing ways, look very closely at the bearings and ways to make sure they were not peened by transport with the table on the machine. Any dings or damage, then run, don't walk, away.