Lathe Collet Adapter Vs Collet Chuck

[G-ManBart]

I'm getting ready to start outfitting a lathe I bought that didn't come with any provision for using collets. I don't expect that will be a primary use, but want to have the capability.

Right now I don't tend to make any significant runs of the same item...usually one or two and done. I'm also not worried about speed since I'm not doing any sort of production.

With that as a background, it seems I've got three choices that will all do the job...buy a collet adapter and manual closer, buy a 5C collet chuck (I have a pretty good set of 5C collets) or consider something like a Jacob's Rubberflex chuck (I have about half a complete set of Rubberflex collets that came with a prior lathe).

It seems like they'll all cost me about the same amount of money give or take so it probably comes down to convenience and accuracy/repeatability.

I'm sort of leaning towards a 5C chuck and maybe the adjustable set-true style, but I'm far from decided. From an accuracy/repeatability standpoint do the other choices offer any advantages? Anything else I'm not considering? I'm not in any rush, so I can wait and watch for deals as well.

 

[Dan_S]

Right now I don't tend to make any significant runs of the same item...usually one or two and done. I'm also not worried about speed since I'm not doing any sort of production.

Honestly, I think the fact that collets don't mar the surface of soft materials is more important.

Anything else I'm not considering? I'm not in any rush, so I can wait and watch for deals as well.

If it was me, I'd go with a 5C adapter and closer. Chuck wrench based 5C chucks require a lot of cranking, I unfortunate have experience with this. A chuck requires more stick out, and is thus less rigid.

A cheap adapter can be hard turned or ground in place. You can also make your own without to much difficulty.

depending on the type of adapter , you can even do interesting stuff like this.

 

[mksj]

Accuracy wise I would probably recommend a set-true mount 5C chuck, you should be under 0.001" in accuracy/repeatability. I use a speed handle on my 5C chuck that makes it much quicker to change out collets. It is a vise speed handle that I made an adapter to be used as a chuck key. Also depends on your chuck mount, if a D1-4 or D1-5 then the PM chcuks offer good quality at a reasonable price, Shar's also has their version.

5-C Adjustable Collet Chuck, D1-4 Mount – Precision Matthews Machinery Co.

www.precisionmatthews.com

 

[erikmannie]

I would go (1) Set-Tru 5C collet chuck, (2) Polish made.

 

[SLK001]

I would go with the adapter/manual closer vs the chuck route, if you have the option. The chuck sticks out too much, isn't as rigid and is not as accurate as a setup using your native spindle.

 

[MrWhoopee]

Another vote for adapter/closer, preferably lever closer. Less overhang, faster release & tighten, much faster collet installation and removal once you learn which way to power the spindle.

 

[Beckerkumm]

I think there are a couple of factors when deciding which route to go.

Do you have a way to ensure that the collet will run true ? A non set tru of Jacobs type might or might not have run out over .001. I like precision when dealing with collets but how much you need will influence the choice as well as the quality of collet needed.

Is the lathe new or used and how stout is it ? A used lathe ( at least mine ) showed the most wear from the point of where the most used chuck holds the stock. If the collet holder is much nearer the spindle, you can easily get a couple thou variation over a couple of inches. If the lathe is lighter duty, stick out can be a problem but if it can run a chuck, and collet chuck will be lighter so that should be a non issue. Cranking a chuck is a pain but I keep a drill with a key on the lathe and use it until the collet starts to feel engaged and then switch to a manual key so I can feel what I'm doing. My favorite is the type with the wheel assuming it runs within .0005 or so. Rubberflex is nice on a large lathe for periodic collet work but I'd want something more accurate on a small machine.

Dave

 

[Ischgl99]

One caution with a collet closer, check how close to the spindle face you can get your cutting tools. I have a PM 1236T and if I used an adapter in the spindle bore for a 5c collet with a closer, I would need to fully extend the compound to get close enough to the face of the collet due to the carriage running into the direction switch housing. With a solid plinth, I am about 2” away with most of my tools, so that was a no go for the closer. That would prevent many operations you would want a 5c collet for, so I elected to go with the collet chuck even thought I wanted a closer since I am making some things in multiple batches.

 

[G-ManBart]

I think there are a couple of factors when deciding which route to go.

Do you have a way to ensure that the collet will run true ? A non set tru of Jacobs type might or might not have run out over .001. I like precision when dealing with collets but how much you need will influence the choice as well as the quality of collet needed.

Is the lathe new or used and how stout is it ? A used lathe ( at least mine ) showed the most wear from the point of where the most used chuck holds the stock. If the collet holder is much nearer the spindle, you can easily get a couple thou variation over a couple of inches. If the lathe is lighter duty, stick out can be a problem but if it can run a chuck, and collet chuck will be lighter so that should be a non issue. Cranking a chuck is a pain but I keep a drill with a key on the lathe and use it until the collet starts to feel engaged and then switch to a manual key so I can feel what I'm doing. My favorite is the type with the wheel assuming it runs within .0005 or so. Rubberflex is nice on a large lathe for periodic collet work but I'd want something more accurate on a small machine.

Dave

Good point...I should have added a few details. The lathe is a Logan 6510H which has a 14" swing with a short bed (about 28" between centers) which is surprisingly stout. I doubted the factory spec weight of 1,600lbs until I saw it in person.

Right now I have the apron off to replace the hand wheel pinion shaft which was damaged in a loading incident (not my fault) so I haven't spent any time checking for bed wear, but the ways look perfect and the rest of the machine is extremely tight and everything is smooth.

I did put a good tenths test indicator on the spindle (threaded 2-1/4 x 8) and it essentially shows zero radial runout...the needle has only the smallest wiggle that I wouldn't even call a full .0001".

The fact the bed is short might make an adapter more attractive since any kind of chuck will use up a lot more space.

I will say reading the responses makes me laugh....it's like you guys are telling me I need one of each or something

 

[G-ManBart]

Here's a pic...unfortunately, it was an auction and they sold all the tooling separately for some reason. I wasn't able to make the pickup day, so I didn't even bid on it. A friend bought a few things from the auction and we had talked about the lathe. When he went to do the pickup they told him the buyer never paid for the lathe, and then the owner put in on Marketplace so I was able to contact him directly and buy it.

Out the door was $700, then another almost $200 for a replacement hand wheel pinion shaft/gear. Luckily it runs smooth and all the feeds/speeds, gears, etc work as they should....not even a single nick on the compound. I talked to the old owner quite a bit and he just raved about it and said it was his machine for doing precision work...all his heavy work was on a much larger lathe. After I get the apron back on I'm going to go through it carefully and if things check out like I think they will, I'm planning to really outfit it nicely.

I would be happier if it had the L-series spindle, or the next size longer bed, but those aren't deal-breakers for me. Right now I use my Sheldon (13x36) for most work and that has a threaded spindle and only slightly longer bed, so I think this will actually be an upgrade in rigidity as well as being variable speed up to 2,000 (Sheldon tops out at 1355).

Auction pic: