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Lodge and Shipley 16"x8' Model X Lathe

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Brain Coral

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#1
Hello gang :)

This forum was looking a little empty, so I went out and bought a L&S lathe... ;)

I have been casually looking for a larger lathe for some time now, and this one showed up on the local Kijiji ads. The pictures were a little fuzzy, so I arranged to go have a look at it, a week ago, a half hour's drive away from me.

Lodge and Shipley  Lathe.jpg


It was way bigger in person... !!! :eek: The owner had won it in an auction when the local Potash mine closed down, and had planned on using it to turn large wooden bowls. He doesn't have 3 phase power and the motor is wired 575 volts, so he just never got around to it and decided to sell it. So, I didn't get the chance to see it run, but I got him to take the head stock cover off and had a look inside. Everything looked brand new and still nice and oily. The ways also look to be in real nice shape, so I bought it. It took me the rest of last week to move stuff around in my shop to make room. I hired a local tilt-and-tow wrecker, who is an excellent operator, to move the lathe for me.

Here's a few pics of the move....

IMG_0177 (1024x768).jpg IMG_0175 (1024x768).jpg

IMG_0178 (1024x768).jpg

I'll post this for now....

Brian :)
 

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Brain Coral

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#2
Here's the lathe on the way home...

IMG_0179 (768x1024).jpg

And back on the floor at my shop....

IMG_0182 (1024x768).jpg


After an initial clean up...

IMG_0204 (1024x768).jpg
 
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#3
Brain,

That is a fine running piece of equipment you have there. I saw your thread on the other forum the other day and the lathe that John Oder mentioned, I wound up with it. I pretty much rebuilt/recondition it from the ground up. I don't have it anymore, it went to a shop down in Laredo, Texas. I don't know how I get it to you, but I have a 12" 4-jaw chuck here that will fit your machine if your interested in it. Also have a couple of L-1 back plates you can have too! I just notice the P & W in the background, another nice lathe to have!
If you need any assistance in figuring out any of the stuff on the "Loose & Shakey" let me know, I'll try to help.

Ken
 
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#4
Oh, the slide rule calculator that is missing from your lathe, I think I have some good pictures of it if you like for me to post, just let me know.
 

Brain Coral

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#5
Hello Ken :)

Thank you for your replies. I do have an American address in Maine that I use to have heavy items shipped to me, so maybe we can work something out. I am very much interested in the chuck and back plates.

Yes, I would love to see some pics of the slide rule, if you will. I realize that obtaining a replacement is a far stretch. I suppose that someone saw something shiny and decided to have it for himself.

I am looking forward to getting this lathe up and running.

Brian :)
 

Ulma Doctor

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#6
Hi Brian,
what a wonderful find!
congratulations
 
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#7
Here's some pictures of the slide rule.

When you are ready, I'll be glad to get with you on what I like to get, price wise, for the chuck and back plates and how to ship. No hurry on my end.

Ken
 

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#8
Here's a picture of the L & S I had as it was loaded up fixing to head to it's new home.
 

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Ulma Doctor

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#9
I wish i was your neighbor Brian!
I'd love to stop by and drool on your equipment for awhile :)
 

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#10
Nice machine , not to big by my standards. Wish I had one in that size range. Good luck she cleaned up nicely .
 

Brain Coral

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#11
Thanks so much, Ken, for the clear pics of the slide rule. I would love to find an original, but with all of the pics, I can't see why I can't print one out by hand. Is that your handy work, or John's?

Brian
 
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#12
Thanks so much, Ken, for the clear pics of the slide rule. I would love to find an original, but with all of the pics, I can't see why I can't print one out by hand. Is that your handy work, or John's?

Brian
On the slide rule? That's factory. I guarantee John could duplicate that by hand and you couldn't tell his work from that from the factory. At least in his earlier years. I've known John Oder for many years, even worked for the man, and he can produce some fine works of art, including making what he designed, too!
 

Brain Coral

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#13
Well, I'll be darned... I guess that I was comparing it to Keith Rucker's lathe. If I do recall, his is brass with a black background, and cast.

That is very cool that you know John Oder. I have the highest respect for the man, even though I have never met him...

Brian :)
 

Brain Coral

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#14
I just notice the P & W in the background, another nice lathe to have!
That lathe in the background is a Prentice Bros. lathe from about 1915 with a very neat headstock design. All gears and clutches with no cone pulleys. I'll have to start a thread on it as well. It was to be my primary winter project, but now I have two... :)

Brian
 
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#15
That lathe in the background is a Prentice Bros. lathe from about 1915 with a very neat headstock design. All gears and clutches with no cone pulleys. I'll have to start a thread on it as well. It was to be my primary winter project, but now I have two... :)

Brian
For some reason I was thinking P & W. I will wait patiently for your posting on your Prentice Brother's lathe.
 
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#16
I intended to mention, make sure the Bijur oil pump in the apron is pumping oil to the entire carriage assembly and not just the apron. Mine was completely stopped up from the apron all the way thru the saddle to the backside. What a mess it was to clean out and get lubricating again. In fact, I installed a automatic cycling lube unit just for the saddle and cross slide.
 

Brain Coral

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#17
Hello Ken,

I intend on taking the saddle and apron off the lathe and will go through it thoroughly, as you suggested. I took the tail stock apart, and off the lathe last night. When this was repainted, they painted over the oil sight glass.... :eek:

Here's a few pics....


IMG_0237 (1024x768) - Copy.jpg IMG_0238 (1024x768).jpg IMG_0239 (1024x768).jpg IMG_0240 (768x1024) - Copy.jpg IMG_0241 (1024x768) - Copy.jpg


Ken, do you know if there would have been oiling wicks from the oil sump to the exit holes ? The holes seem to be very near the top of the sump, and I would think that would have been the case. I don't see any mention in my parts diagram, but I might add them, just the same.

Brian
 
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#18
Ken, do you know if there would have been oiling wicks from the oil sump to the exit holes ? The holes seem to be very near the top of the sump, and I would think that would have been the case. I don't see any mention in my parts diagram, but I might add them, just the same.

Brian
Yes, there should be oiling wicks to capitulate the oil to the slide surfaces. Sure shows a lot of wear there. Probably will have to shim up between the two pieces to bring the center height back up to the spindle height. I'll check and see if I have some pictures of mine when I rebuilt the tailstock.
Ken
 

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Brain Coral

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#19
Hi Ken :)

The oiling wicks only made sense to me. The originals likely rotted away over time. There is a slight ridge of wear visible on the flat way of the tail stock bed. You can catch it, barely, with a fingernail, but I have yet to measure the difference between the original hand scraped surface and the worn area. After nearly 65 years of use, I will expect that there will be some wear in this lathe. It is, unfortunate, that it wasn't properly maintained throughout it's working career, but I will deal with whatever comes my way.

Just to be clear, I will not be regrinding the ways, nor Turciting the saddle, but I will work hard at getting this lathe working much better than it did before I purchased it. I don't have the money to do a full restoration, but I will likely replace all of the bearings in the apron, and there are many,

Brian :)
 
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#20
When you start getting into the bearings in the apron, don't get all hung up on all of the bearing numbers on the existing bearings. Most I replaced with more standard bearings numbers and went with all sealed, not shielded bearings where I could. There is one roller bearing that was a bear getting the outer race out of the housing. Had to go borrow a internal puller from O Riley Auto Supply to pull it out. I would suggest you rebuilding the Bijur oil pump also. Replace the felt and screen. Those parts are readily available on the net. The pump itself is untainable at any cost, unless you get lucky and find a good used one out there. Hopefully, the gearing is in decent shape. L & S parts, I believe, are available from Monarch Machine Tool at gold standard prices. Like me, make your own!

Yeah, I hope your bed is in better shape than mine was. I did regrind ways on mine. And yes, I used Molglice to raise the carriage back up in proper alignment. I presume you found my posts on Practical Machinists on the rebuild I did on my L&S. Doing all of this is not necessary in all cases. And your lathe looks to be in decent shape and probably has very little wear to the ways, if any at all.
 

Brain Coral

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#21
Hi Ken,

Thanks for the tips on the apron bearings and the tip about rebuilding the Bijur oil pump. This lathe will be a nice challenge for me, due to it's complexity. It looks like the ways on my lathe, have very little, if any, wear on them. Sure, they are stained in places, but I don't see any obvious signs of wear, particularly the tool steel ways that the saddle rides on. I suspect, though, that the wear will show up in the saddle and tail stock.

To be honest with you, I haven't come across your rebuild thread yet. I will have to go and check it out, as I am certain that I will learn a lot from it.

Brian
 

Ulma Doctor

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#22
Hi Brian,
looking good man!
that tailstock looks like it gotta weigh a few hundred pounds, serious iron there!

i have a tip for you, in case you have not heard this one...
when it comes to removing stubborn bearing races that are captured on the OD and frozen in place.
simply run a tig or mig pass on the id of the frozen race, it will (nearly) fall out as the metal shrinks
i have to use the method sometimes on highvac pumps.
i first saw the method when my uncle had his valve seats upgraded on his BMW motorcycle heads.
i was lucky enough that the guy doing it had an extra hood and let me watch, i was 17 at the time.
i have used the method hundreds of times, i hope the idea may help you.
all the best
 
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#23
Brain,

I meant to ask, did your tractor pick up you lathe? I know mine weighed in at 8,000 lbs. and yours is about two or three feet longer than mine.

Ken
 

Brain Coral

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#24
Hey Ken,

The tractor in the initial photos belongs to the former owner of the lathe. He was just getting some of the weight to help the towing guy get it going up the ramp. There was no way that even that big JD could have lifted it on the head stock end, even a little bit. I estimate that my lathe weighs in at around 8,900 lbs.

Brian
 

Brain Coral

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#25
Hi Mike :)

Thanks for the tip on removing stuck bearing races. I don't have any welding equipment, yet, but I have a friend who does. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that you are close about the tail stock weighing a few hundred pounds. Everything about this lathe is massive, compared to all of the lathes that I have worked on before.

Brian
 

Brain Coral

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#26
I'm back again, with a small update... :)

I had a bit of time in the shop and took the rest of the tail stock apart and had a good look at the underside of the main body. All of the hand scraping looks good. The rear oiling hole on the top was open and lots of oil present in the bronze nut, spindle shaft and thrust bearing.

Here's a photo of some of the parts...





The thrust bearing seems to be in pretty good shape, but I may replace it. The forward oiling hole was plugged solid with chips, but there was oil all through the spindle and bore. When I went to move the quick cam bed locking lever at the rear of the tail stock, it simply slid out and the eye bolt stud fell into the chip pan. When I got the tail stock turned on it's side, I discovered that the dog point set screws were backed way out for some reason. Once I removed the set screws, I could see that there was a small hole in the roof of the bore, directly in line with the set screw holes. Then, I noticed the small oiling hole in the side of the casting that looked like it would line up at 90° to the other hole, and carry oil to the cam shaft.





The cam shaft has a series of oiling holes and passages for the three separate bores. These were free and clear of obstruction. The oiling hole took a considerable amount of effort to clear it out of tightly packed chips. This goes to show, that unless you take something completely apart, you can't be certain that oil is getting to where it should.

IMG_0245 (1024x768).jpg IMG_0247 (768x1024).jpg IMG_0246 (1024x768).jpg IMG_0248 (1024x768).jpg

Brian
 
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#27
Brain,

You need to get some Gits oil cups to put in those holes. McMaster-Carr carries them. I buy and keep a few on hand for things like this. And yes, I had to replace some of the Gits cups on my L & S too. Overall, your tailstock looks darn good for a 63 year old lathe!

Ken
 

Brain Coral

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#28
Brain,

You need to get some Gits oil cups to put in those holes. McMaster-Carr carries them. I buy and keep a few on hand for things like this. And yes, I had to replace some of the Gits cups on my L & S too. Overall, your tailstock looks darn good for a 63 year old lathe!

Ken
Hi Ken,

I have ordered a good selection of Gits oilers, and they are on their way. On the tail stock, there are three different sizes of holes. I may have to redrill a couple of the entrance holes to fit the oilers.

Brian
 

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#29
I'm back again, with a small update... :)

I had a bit of time in the shop and took the rest of the tail stock apart and had a good look at the underside of the main body. All of the hand scraping looks good. The rear oiling hole on the top was open and lots of oil present in the bronze nut, spindle shaft and thrust bearing.

Here's a photo of some of the parts...





The thrust bearing seems to be in pretty good shape, but I may replace it. The forward oiling hole was plugged solid with chips, but there was oil all through the spindle and bore. When I went to move the quick cam bed locking lever at the rear of the tail stock, it simply slid out and the eye bolt stud fell into the chip pan. When I got the tail stock turned on it's side, I discovered that the dog point set screws were backed way out for some reason. Once I removed the set screws, I could see that there was a small hole in the roof of the bore, directly in line with the set screw holes. Then, I noticed the small oiling hole in the side of the casting that looked like it would line up at 90° to the other hole, and carry oil to the cam shaft.





The cam shaft has a series of oiling holes and passages for the three separate bores. These were free and clear of obstruction. The oiling hole took a considerable amount of effort to clear it out of tightly packed chips. This goes to show, that unless you take something completely apart, you can't be certain that oil is getting to where it should.

View attachment 244341 View attachment 244342 View attachment 244343 View attachment 244344

Brian
Brian,

That tailstock looks like it's in remarkable condition. I think you've found a very nice machine. We have a couple of very large L&S machines here at work, as well I got to do some work with one your size at the MSR&LHA shop in Cass, WV on a locomotive restoration project a couple years ago.

My big lathe is a 1936 vintage Reed Prentice 16x80. It's had a rough life, but still kicking! Best of luck, I hope you get as much enjoyment out of your machines as I do mine.

-Jake 2017-03-18 13.23.12.jpg
 
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#30
Good old Reed Prentice lathe. Used to be a good old work horse in it's time. We used to have a big Reed Prentice No. 5 Jig mill they used to build. Talking about something that would give you a workout every time you ran it, it would!
 
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