Pin Gages

RandyM said:
This thread had me thinking over the weekend. What is everyone making as a hobbyist machinist that requires you to need a set of pin gages? The closest I have ever come is a caliper and a boring head. I haven't yet found the real need for reamers much less pin gages. Though, I am pretty sure that given enough time I will want a set of reamers. I guess for that matter surface plates are another thing I am struggling with for a hobby machinist. Just what is all the precision stuff you guys are making, it apparently is a secret as I have not seen any postings, OK other than the watch makers and the engine builders.
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I think we have some people on this site that are in cognito and really work for NASA…LOL. And yes of coarse a drill bit shaft is not a nominal size. And it could be all screwed up to if you spun it in the drill chuck. Use common sense when accuracy is at question…please.
 
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You can make all sorts of useful stuff with no measurements at all. Medieval blacksmiths made exquisite lock and key sets long before precision measurements were available. When you are trying to make parts that are going to fit something someone else has made, measurements become important. If I want to bore a hole for a tight slip fit on a shaft, I will need to measure. If I want a light press fit, I will need to measure. If I am going to make a part for my neighbor's lawn mower, I will need to measure. It all depends on what kind of projects you work on.

Over the years, I think that I have become more inclined to make things to print, even if the item is perfectly functional if it isn't. It is a good quality to develop as it requires more discipline in machining and there will be a time when that discipline will be needed. Besides, it's a good feeling to draw up a plan for a part and finally have a part in yoour hand that matches the plan.

Bottom line it's each to his own. As hobbyists, we only have ourselves to answer to. If you can get by without ever making a precision measurement, that's great. And if you feel that you have to have all your measurement instruments in current calibration, traceable to NIST, that's great too.
 
RandyM said:
What is everyone making as a hobbyist machinist that requires you to need a set of pin gages?
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Gunsmithing tools.
want to make a mandrel for a 700 remington? Not gonna measure that with something that's not round.
I find the pin gages real handy for getting a hole to size by using a smaller gage to know when you're getting close.
Or in the case of the rem action to gage the hole size to machine the mandrel to size.
 
RandyM said:
What is everyone making as a hobbyist machinist that requires you to need a set of pin gages?
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If you have a shaft and need to bore a nice snug sliding fit hole for it with no wobble at all, how do you do it? I measure the shaft and then sneak up on it using pin gages to see where I am after each pass. It goes quickly, no fancy measuring stuff used, just any mic and some gage pins with accurate .0010" increments. Most other approaches allow you to very easily blow right past the fit you want while boring. It is actually the lowest tech way to do that particular job relatively quickly and expect to get a good result.

Next, you want to test a part to see if it is flat. How are you going to do it without a surface plate? The surface plate will do the job quickly and with predictable results.

Those are not high tech, snooty jobs, just someone trying to get it done...
 
Thank you everyone for your responses. I think I have been a little misinterpreted. I completely understand what gage pins and surface plates are used for and thank you for the examples of use, however other than gun making (thank you RGRAY) and my already mentioned watch and engine making I am not convinced I need either of these items as of yet. Sure, they are nice to have in the toolbox, but as for having on my want and needs list I have not been give good reason. I find I can still do all of the things that are described here with the measuring equipment I currently have, calipers, micrometers, and straight edges. As a hobbyist I am convinced that these are tools that I may want when I have more money than I know what to do with and an empty spot in my toolbox. I have a lot of other things I would want to spend my money on before adding them. And, I was not making any Snooty Job implications, you arrived at that conclusion all on your own. I did not intend to upset anyone here. I am just trying to understand if I actually have a need for these tools, and unfortunately so far you guys really aren't making the case. I am thinking that unless I get surface and tool post grinders, surface plates and gage pins are something I can (and so far) do with out. Again, these tools look like items that are more of a luxury for a hobbyist. Sure, I'll concede that the examples you are giving make the measuring process easier, but again, I can do it with the trusty measuring tools I already have. Sorry, just my conclusion from what has been presented so far. Now granted, I was making some of my projects with hacksaws and files prior to a mill purchase. Did I need a mill? One could argue that I didn't. And yes, it has definitely improved the quality of my projects. Other examples are CNC and Variable Speed Drives. Now, I do understand WANTS and this looks very much like these tools fit into this category. Also, one could make the case, my hobbyist machining is all just a want and not a need as well. HHHMmm, I think I just answered my own question.

Carry on everyone.
 
RandyM said:
Thank you everyone for your responses. I think I have been a little misinterpreted. I completely understand what gage pins and surface plates are used for and thank you for the examples of use, however other than gun making (thank you RGRAY) and my already mentioned watch and engine making I am not convinced I need either of these items as of yet. Sure, they are nice to have in the toolbox, but as for having on my want and needs list I have not been give good reason. I find I can still do all of the things that are described here with the measuring equipment I currently have, calipers, micrometers, and straight edges. As a hobbyist I am convinced that these are tools that I may want when I have more money than I know what to do with and an empty spot in my toolbox. I have a lot of other things I would want to spend my money on before adding them. And, I was not making any Snooty Job implications, you arrived at that conclusion all on your own. I did not intend to upset anyone here. I am just trying to understand if I actually have a need for these tools, and unfortunately so far you guys really aren't making the case. I am thinking that unless I get surface and tool post grinders, surface plates and gage pins are something I can (and so far) do with out. Again, these tools look like items that are more of a luxury for a hobbyist. Sure, I'll concede that the examples you are giving make the measuring process easier, but again, I can do it with the trusty measuring tools I already have. Sorry, just my conclusion from what has been presented so far. Now granted, I was making some of my projects with hacksaws and files prior to a mill purchase. Did I need a mill? One could argue that I didn't. And yes, it has definitely improved the quality of my projects. Other examples are CNC and Variable Speed Drives. Now, I do understand WANTS and this looks very much like these tools fit into this category. Also, one could make the case, my hobbyist machining is all just a want and not a need as well. HHHMmm, I think I just answered my own question.

Carry on everyone.
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First, I think the term "Hobby" is rather broad, while technically it means "non professional" that definition often gets blurred, especially when it is also a potentially lucrative skill.
Like most endeavors, It means as many different things as there are people practicing it. So my point is, what is not necessary for you could easily be a must have for others, it's just a matter of perspective and how one practices their craft. I for example, would find very difficult to work without my surface plate and height gauge, yet I don't have a set pin gauges... yet.
 
Everyones hobby machinist needs are going to be different. Everyone has a different approach/idea on how to complete the projects they have. Everyones pocket book is different. Not everyone is a toolaholic, like me. But is ranting or pounding the key board about having a set of gage pins really going to be heard by everyone? If you are a true hobbyist (THAT INCLUDES BEING CLEVER), then I think you can work around it and do without a set. If you are a toolahloic, then I need not answer. If your hobby work has a definitive purpose for a set, then by all means get a set of gage pins…Dave

PS: I just checked eBay, you can get a new set of gage pins for measly 50 bucks! I don’t know about other folks, but the wife and I spend more than that on a night out for dinner in the Bay Area. So just get a set and then get back to us and tell us how you like them and how often you use them.
 
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Eddyde said:
First, I think the term "Hobby" is rather broad, while technically it means "non professional" that definition often gets blurred, especially when it is also a potentially lucrative skill.
Like most endeavors, It means as many different things as there are people practicing it. So my point is, what is not necessary for you could easily be a must have for others, it's just a matter of perspective and how one practices their craft. I for example, would find very difficult to work without my surface plate and height gauge, yet I don't have a set pin gauges... yet.
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Correct, I am specifically talking about Hobbyist, so I am respectfully in disagreement with you on this.

On your second point, I agree with you, you may find it a little more difficult, but not necessary for the hobbyist.

hobby1
Examples
See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
noun, plural hobbies.
1.
an activity or interest pursued for pleasure or relaxation and not as a main occupation:
Her hobbies include stamp-collecting and woodcarving.

Now, Chips&more and I are definitely on the same page.
 
Didn't really want to respond to an old thread, but just goes to show you how awesome this forum is, have you ever read a more entertaining and educational "want ad". I completely forgot I was in the classified section.
 
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