Recommendation for which Asian Lathe to buy.

@macardoso has covered a lot, well done.

As far as a used CNC, it could make sense if you are making decent money with it. If something goes wrong, the cost to fix it will likely be very high. Older CNC controls regularly become obsolete with little/no OEM support. No many keep these types of machines for more than 20 years, and even that is pushing it, so the parts market will generally reflect that. We just ran into a control issue on a 1998 Mazak lathe. The control needed a minor repair, but the part was no longer on the shelves, nor is it being made anymore (PC based windows 95 control). This was an $11,000 repair to upgrade the entire control board. 10 years ago it would have cost maybe $300 when the parts were still available. Just do your research to hopefully avoid a situation like this.

If you do go the old CNC route, a HAAS TL-1 would be an excellent choice. We have one that is 18 years old, no issues getting parts ... and it can run on single-phase 220V.

I would also watch your budget. If you are going to make any money at all with the lathe, this should not enter your mind. I went all-in on a fully loaded PM1236 for about $5500. It is a good lathe and has served me well for the parts I make. Looking back, it has paid for itself many times over (the first time within just a few months of taking delivery). If I was to do it over again ... a 1340 or 1440GT would be my first choice. Today, I REALLY want to upgrade to a higher quality machine, it would have been easier to just spend the extra $2k the first time around.

Go small and cheap if you want to tinker and not necessarily profit, but please consider a Taiwan made 12x36 as the bare minimum if you plan to spend time in front of it making parts. The Chinese quality lathes will make the parts, but you will not have a smile on your face for long.
 
I've said this sort of thing before, and I'll repeat it here: if you want a decent machine, and you want to save money, buy used.

Trying to save money while buying a new machine means you're going to end up with a limited or under-sized machine with casting problems, poor fit, poor design, etc. You don't know what you're getting until it arrives, and given the shipping costs it is by then too late to deal with even immediately-evident problems.

When buying used, you have a chance to evaluate the machine, talk to the previous owner, and so forth. There is still the problem of not knowing a good machine when you see it, and that is a very real problem, but there are ways to deal with that.

Of course, the destination for the machine (space available, stairs or doorways intervening, etc) is ultimately the limiting factor.
 
macardoso said:
These things are just expensive...

A real entry level CNC lathe will probably run you $20-30k. You can buy an older used one, but then you have a project to get it running and learn it. You would need to be excited about refurbishing it as much as using it. They'll be very large and heavy and will most likely need 3 phase power. There isn't a huge market for CNCs designed for home use (especially lathes) and Tormach has cornered that market.

Tormach Lathes

CNC LATHES THAT LOWER THE BARRIERS TO BUY, LEARN AND USE. Cure The "I'm Starting-My-Machine-Shop-In-A-Few-Years" Cycle. This Is Your Time. Start Building Your Dream Projects.
tormach.com tormach.com

I have a 12" lathe I bought used ($1200 from a used machinery dealer). It has a quick change gearbox and change gears for metric threads. The head of the lathe is manually changed belts. I do not think this is a big deal and I don't often need to change the external change gears (couple dozen times in 3 years). When I do change gears, it is a 5 minute job and is pretty easy. Your call how to spend your money, but changing gears really isn't a big deal. With 4 change gears, I can do a full complement of imperial and metric threads. Here is a link to a thread I wrote about my lathe. It might help you understand what is needed:

www.hobby-machinist.com

Enco 12x36 Lathe Rebuild (Picture Heavy!)

Hi All, I recently purchased an Enco110-2033 gap bed lathe from a industrial surplus business for around $1100. It's more than some have spent on a lathe like this, but it was available nearby my house and in beautiful condition under the significant amount of grime that had coated it. This...
www.hobby-machinist.com www.hobby-machinist.com

Precision Matthews is in PA and does demos of their equipment (unsure how COVID affects this). Might be worthwhile to take a trip to see them.

HGR is the machinery dealer in Euclid, OH (Cleveland area) I got my lathe from. Their inventory is constantly rotating. You can check what they have. Most everything will be used and often pretty expensive, but you can definitely get good deals. The price on stuff drops as time goes on so save items and check back. With used machinery you need to evaluate condition (wear and damage), as well as power requirements and spare part availability. Again, you're taking on a project when you buy used, make sure you are OK with that.

Used Industrial Equipment For Sale

Used Industrial Equipment For Sale https://hgrinc.com
hgrinc.com hgrinc.com
Click to expand...

Alright a CNC lathe is off from the question.

For you it will be 5 mins to change the gears and for me it will be 50 mins even if I'm experienced lol

Paying extra for a fully enclosed gearbox is absolutely worth the money as long it is fairly priced, I'm completely alright with that, I'm sure others would agree. I'm buying this lathe specifically for all kinds of thread work, my chances of changing gears in a year will be more high than others. To my knowledge it seems like a fully enclosed gearbox are only included in the higher end of lathes which are precision lathes, seems like it's perfect for my needs. It's like buying a car and when you need to change the gear, the driver needs to make a quick stop and do a 5 min gear change and hit the road again, same logic with lathes, I find this lathe industry quite silly and interesting when people are spending thousands of dollars and yet the machinist needs to do a 5 min gear change lol

Any recommendation which P Matthews lathes would fit the bill for a fully automatic enclosed gearbox where one would never need to manually change gears for different threading on metric and imperial, I hope there is such lathe out there.

Thanks for your helpful insights!
 
bakrch said:
@macardoso has covered a lot, well done.

As far as a used CNC, it could make sense if you are making decent money with it. If something goes wrong, the cost to fix it will likely be very high. Older CNC controls regularly become obsolete with little/no OEM support. No many keep these types of machines for more than 20 years, and even that is pushing it, so the parts market will generally reflect that. We just ran into a control issue on a 1998 Mazak lathe. The control needed a minor repair, but the part was no longer on the shelves, nor is it being made anymore (PC based windows 95 control). This was an $11,000 repair to upgrade the entire control board. 10 years ago it would have cost maybe $300 when the parts were still available. Just do your research to hopefully avoid a situation like this.

If you do go the old CNC route, a HAAS TL-1 would be an excellent choice. We have one that is 18 years old, no issues getting parts ... and it can run on single-phase 220V.

I would also watch your budget. If you are going to make any money at all with the lathe, this should not enter your mind. I went all-in on a fully loaded PM1236 for about $5500. It is a good lathe and has served me well for the parts I make. Looking back, it has paid for itself many times over (the first time within just a few months of taking delivery). If I was to do it over again ... a 1340 or 1440GT would be my first choice. Today, I REALLY want to upgrade to a higher quality machine, it would have been easier to just spend the extra $2k the first time around.

Go small and cheap if you want to tinker and not necessarily profit, but please consider a Taiwan made 12x36 as the bare minimum if you plan to spend time in front of it making parts. The Chinese quality lathes will make the parts, but you will not have a smile on your face for long.
Click to expand...

I do have plans to make profit with the help of the lathe but more importantly before profits comes into play, not changing gears is important.
Does PM 1340 or 1440GT have a fully enclosed gearbox? Would I have to do a "5 min" gear change for different threads sizes for both imperial and metric? Is there any lathe that does not require for a "5 min" gear change?

Thanks!
 
rajhliux said:
I do have plans to make profit with the help of the lathe but more importantly before profits comes into play, not changing gears is important.
Does PM 1340 or 1440GT have a fully enclosed gearbox? Would I have to do a "5 min" gear change for different threads sizes for both imperial and metric? Is there any lathe that does not require for a "5 min" gear change?

Thanks!
Click to expand...

Somebody else that threads a lot on a manual will have to chime in here, but you're going to have some degree of pain going between a bunch of different thread pitches. Best you are going to do is "minimal change gears". The 18" and 22" Taiwanese Summit lathes that I use at work have most of them covered without the need to change gears, but these are $20k+ Taiwanese lathes.

You will probably also be hand cranking the spindle with the half nut engaged for imperial or metric threads.

I would write down all of the thread pitches you are going to cut regularly and post them up, somebody here with experience on that end will find the prudent path. Or, you could just call up Matt at PM to get direction there.
 
rajhliux said:
Alright a CNC lathe is off from the question.

For you it will be 5 mins to change the gears and for me it will be 50 mins even if I'm experienced lol

Paying extra for a fully enclosed gearbox is absolutely worth the money as long it is fairly priced, I'm completely alright with that, I'm sure others would agree. I'm buying this lathe specifically for all kinds of thread work, my chances of changing gears in a year will be more high than others. To my knowledge it seems like a fully enclosed gearbox are only included in the higher end of lathes which are precision lathes, seems like it's perfect for my needs. It's like buying a car and when you need to change the gear, the driver needs to make a quick stop and do a 5 min gear change and hit the road again, same logic with lathes, I find this lathe industry quite silly and interesting when people are spending thousands of dollars and yet the machinist needs to do a 5 min gear change lol

Any recommendation which P Matthews lathes would fit the bill for a fully automatic enclosed gearbox where one would never need to manually change gears for different threading on metric and imperial, I hope there is such lathe out there.

Thanks for your helpful insights!
Click to expand...

The question isn't so much how often you'll change gears, but rather how often you need to switch between inch and metric. The cheapest lathes will change all the gears for each thread (that sucks), but the mid price ones (like mine) will have a quick change gearbox which covers many different threads and I only need to switch them when going from inch to metric or a really oddball thread. A fully enclosed gearbox is a real commodity and is only featured on production machinery. Gear change is usually only needed between jobs and can be put in the same bucket as tooling and work holding setup time.

But totally up to you. If you have the cash for a nice lathe then... a nice lathe is what you'll get.
 
ThinWoodsman said:
I've said this sort of thing before, and I'll repeat it here: if you want a decent machine, and you want to save money, buy used.

Trying to save money while buying a new machine means you're going to end up with a limited or under-sized machine with casting problems, poor fit, poor design, etc. You don't know what you're getting until it arrives, and given the shipping costs it is by then too late to deal with even immediately-evident problems.

When buying used, you have a chance to evaluate the machine, talk to the previous owner, and so forth. There is still the problem of not knowing a good machine when you see it, and that is a very real problem, but there are ways to deal with that.

Of course, the destination for the machine (space available, stairs or doorways intervening, etc) is ultimately the limiting factor.
Click to expand...

I'm not a true machinist, just a straight up noob. I totally agree with the logic of buying a used lathe, but a noob like myself has no idea where to even begin on finding one and hassel with all the repairs or what not for a used lathe. A noob will be wasting so much time it will be a project to refurbish the used lathe. I hate refurbishing stuff. Would rather pay a good bill for a new product that is ready to be used straight out of the box. I don't think there is any used lathe in the market which has a fully automatic gearbox for changing imperial and metric.
 
rajhliux said:
I do have plans to make profit with the help of the lathe but more importantly before profits comes into play, not changing gears is important.
Does PM 1340 or 1440GT have a fully enclosed gearbox? Would I have to do a "5 min" gear change for different threads sizes for both imperial and metric? Is there any lathe that does not require for a "5 min" gear change?

Thanks!
Click to expand...

According to the manual, the PM1440GT still has external change gears to switch between inch and metric (and that's a $8500+ lathe). This is just something everyone deals with and it really isn't a big deal. Do it once and you'll be an expert.

Another alternative is an electronic leadscrew, where a computer driven motor emulates the gears in a normal lathe. Punch in the thread you want and off you go. But you have to build this aftermarket and it is a project. Nobody is making a manual lathe that you would consider with this feature standard.
 
rajhliux said:
I'm not a true machinist, just a straight up noob. I totally agree with the logic of buying a used lathe, but a noob like myself has no idea where to even begin on finding one and hassel with all the repairs or what not for a used lathe. A noob will be wasting so much time it will be a project to refurbish the used lathe. I hate refurbishing stuff. Would rather pay a good bill for a new product that is ready to be used straight out of the box. I don't think there is any used lathe in the market which has a fully automatic gearbox for changing imperial and metric.
Click to expand...

If you do want to consider a used machine from HGR, I am 15 minutes from there. I'd be willing to help you with looking over a lathe if you'd like. But that is a road trip for you. There is money to be saved for the penny wise, but a new machine should be perfect out of the box, where a used one might not.
 
Count me in for that road trip. I was all ready to head over there before all this COVID nonsense. I may never leave the building.
 
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