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Rockwell 10 Inch Draw Tube

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gwarner

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#1
I finally found some 4C collets that I was willing to pay the asking price on. They should arrive soon.
I want to get started on making a draw bar. If someone could be so kind as to post the dimensions on the draw bar I would be most thankful. Based on my initial measurements it don't seem to have much room for error. I need the OD of the

If anyone has made their own I am wondering if you started with some piping or solid stock. If you used pipe where did you source it. Lastly did you harden it.
 

BGHansen

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#2
Hi gwarner,

I have an original 4-C collet closer for my 10 x 36. Let me know if you need any dimensions.

Bruce

CIMG3501.JPG CIMG3503.JPG
 

gwarner

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#3
Oh yes I remember you from an earlier post, That is the same lathe that I have a pair of twins of.
If you could give me the OD of the shaft and the length to where it makes contact with the back of the spindle that would be great.
The ID will be determined by the threads I will need to cut. I will get those from the collets when they arrive.
I assume the shaft needs to be hallow all the way through so I can insert longer stock.
Does it have thrust bearings?
 

BGHansen

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#4
Just got home from work, will try to get out in my shop tomorrow for the dimensions. Mine does have a thrust bearing and is hollow.

Bruce
 

4GSR

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Here's a couple of drawings I picked up from somewhere on the internet that may be of help to you guys.
Ken
4C+Adapter.jpg 4C+Collet.jpg
 

gwarner

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#6
Ken, Thanks for the measurements. Based on what I have researched I am going to try and make one from 3/4 inch schedule 40 pipe.

My big problem is I ordered the collets from 2 sources. The ones that came today were the best condition and the sizes and what I was most excited about. I went down to try one and it did not fit my lathes. After some measurements and research the ones I got today measured out to be 4s collets. I never even knew 4s existed until today.
I have contacted he seller and am awaiting their response.
Here is what I found
The threads on these are .982 and the bore is .998 and the length is 3.25
Here are the specs on 4s 0.998" 3.250" 0.982 x 20 RH
Here are 4C collet specs 4C 0.950" 3.000" 0.938 x 20 RH
I had got 5 of them for $30. i figured it was too good to be true:(
 

gwarner

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#7
When I got home from work tonight my second order of collets came. These are 4c. YEEHAW.

I found a piece of 1" stainless pipe in my scrap pile that came off a treadmill.
Unbelievably I got what I would call a perfect fit on the threads with out screwing it up. Only took about 10 minutes Excluding setup in the steady.
Right now I have just an internally threaded pipe.
I am now at a point where I need an accurate measurement.
What is the length from the end of the bar where the threads are to where the tapered piece that touches the back of the spindle starts.

I also am wondering if that tapered piece actually seats the collet. Currently with just the pipe I can seat the collets. The threaded end presses against a raised ridge inside the spindle and pulls it in.
I only tired it with about 2 collets but both seemed to grip the stock firmly. However I am not sure it is seating it fully.

Any information would be truly appreciated. Thanks
 

4GSR

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Bruce, can you chime in and help gwarner since you have a actual collet setup?
 

BGHansen

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#9
Finally got a chance to get some photos/measurements. Hope you can read the dimensions off my hen scratching.

The OD of the "raw" draw bar tube is 1.052". The rotating collar is an OD of 2.000". The draw bar is turned down to 1.000" OD under the rotating collar on through under the aluminum wheel. I've got some dimensions for the working end of the collets and draw bar too. Hope this helps!

Bruce


20160220_073448.jpg 20160220_073617.jpg 20160220_073627.jpg 20160220_075609.jpg
 

gwarner

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#10
Thanks Bruce the measurements were exactly what I was needing. The 10.38 was a little shorter then I had calculated via trial and error. I had mine at at 10 and 1/2' so I moved it in .12.
A few other differences are I cut the bevel at 30 degrees instead of 45 and my piece is fixed. It does not rotate. I may redo that at a later time
My draw bar seems to work well. I have already trialed it on several collets and it holds them tight and best of all concentric.
But I can see that the tightening action would cause wear on the back of my spindle.

For now I am calling this draw bar complete and am onto the thread protector. That one is very obvious and not critical so I wont need to bug anyone for assistance on that.

Thanks again guys.
 

4GSR

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Thanks Bruce.

I apology for barging in with my first post. You are a great help! I don't care what the other half says!

Ken
 

BGHansen

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#12
Thanks Bruce.

I apology for barging in with my first post. You are a great help! I don't care what the other half says!

Ken
No problem! It was either get out in my shop and take some measurements or go out and cut firewood. Photo below is what we go through each and every year . . . 40 ft. long by 7 ft. high by 3 rows deep. I sometime feels like repeating Danny Glover's line from the Lethal Weapons series if you catch my drift!

Oh, did run 2 tanks through the Stihl 029 today. That's 19 tanks of fuel through the saw so far this year, usually run around 25.

Bruce

upload_2016-2-20_16-4-40.png
 

4GSR

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Thats a LOT of fire wood!

It hasn't got cold enough down here this winter to fire up the fire place, not even once. IT's almost 80 degrees outside! Have about six logs setting on the back porch just in case we get a chance to start a fire this winter.
 

gwarner

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#14
Went to Lowes yesterday for some plumbing parts and while there I went ahead and picked up a stick of 3/4 schedule 40 black pipe.
Last evening I went ahead and made a second draw bar. The schedule 40 is the perfect choice for this project. The stainless I used was about .020 undersized on the OD.
I made it so the beveled piece rotates and thus will not abrade the spindle when tightening it.

Here are the drawbars and thread protector with my collets
PICT0022.JPG
Here is the collet with the longest threads fully screwed in.
PICT0024.JPG

While the first one only took about 10 minutes to cut the threads this one took a lot longer. I had more boring to do to get the ID correct. In addition to that while doing the threads and just as I was finishing up my lathe motor decided to act up. I had shut it off to test the fit and it screwed in snugly but stopped about half way. I figured another spring cut and it should be good to go. I hit the switch and the motor just hummed. Luckily it was just a dirty contact on the split phase motor and I was able to get it going again. There is no way I was going to be able to move to the other lathe and repeat the setup.
Anyway this is actually an easy project and I would encourage anyone who has to make their own to go for it.
 

astjp2

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#15
Get a thrust bearing and you wont have any wear, my 11" has a bearing on it so it does not rub on the spindle. Tim
 

gwarner

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#16
The second one I made will not wear the spindle. I more closely followed the design Bruce posted. The part rotates and acts like a bearing. This could wear on the handle but that could take years before it would become an issue.
If you look at the draw bar in front you will see I just used a set screw on the tapered part. That one was the one that would create wear one the spindle. Someday I will get ambitious and fix that one as well.
 
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