Rockwell Vertical Knee Mill Milling Machine - $3,500 (Sacramento, CA)

Having a Rockwell mill is a vast step up from a Shop Task. That said, it still has small mill limitations. Adding power feed and DRO may be lipstick on a pig, but it's my pig.
 
As always seems to come up, these are not a Bridgeport, not even close but they are an option if you don't have the room for a Bridgeport.
Ceiling height is often a concern with mills and both of these will fit into a shop with a 6-1/2 foot ceiling.
 
I bought one just like this about a year ago for 3K. I was almost unused, had lived in a storage room at a vocational school for decades. I flew to Buffalo NY to box it up and ship home to New Orleans ($270). It has VFD but came with no tooling. It is extremely accurate, the whole 16" Y axis runs within a couple thou when I measured the backlash. Cuts steel like butter. I'm fitting DRO next week. paid $273 on ebay for a "ToAuto" asian that looks fine and are sending one 6" and two 16" scales. I'm not an engineer but have spent 5 years cutting aluminum on an old delta drill press with an X/Y table and using this mill is like being freed from a prison chain gang. Did I pay too much? I wanted this mill and had been looking awhile. I passed up many Clausings bc I was told by a guy who had owned both that the Rockwells are firmer. (I cut steel to make my own tooling but the parts I make are mostly alum, brass, delrin.) 3K is the high end of what these sell for in nice useable shape. This one was cherry, by far the nicest I saw and it had VFD. I jumped on it bc its what I wanted. I'm happy I did. it's a joy to use. Can't wait to get the DRO pinging coordinates. It takes me forever to figure out where in hell I am w/o it.
 
I looked over the new mills like the Grizzly and other chinese made. The Grizzly is a direct copy of the Rockwell. I run a few old american machines (Seneca Falls lathe, old Rockwell DP, Rockwell geared band saw and they are super dependable. the chinese stuff Ive bought are always full of disappointments, small and large. I figure I'm way ahead with 40 year old US made ( 70's really the golden age) stuff bc it costs alot less than new Asian and just bc its also just better. It might not make a better part but it makes a better experience. I have not run a Grizzly so I'm basing this half off my own experience and half what I hear on this forum and Prac Machinist. For myself I needed to use a mill and did not want a project so I was looking for one in really good shape and found a good one. Its always a trasde off I found other Rockwells for much less but the machines has some question marks, the people were flighty and it was a risk to fly out to buy it. The guy I found was a machinery obsessed engineer with a basement so stuffed with lathes and mills it was like a museum. I needed a vise, he prob had 15 to choose from. Chucks, end mills, collets- it was Wal Mart for fine US made machine tools. I want to go back!
 
The original posting is gone, lasted less than a week. I'd be curious to know what the actual selling price was.

I saw that there is a Clausing 8520 not far from where this Rockwell was being sold and it is asking $3600. At $2000-2500 they don't last long, often less than 72 hours so the asking prices may be going up. I still think the guy who was asking $6500 was oxygen deprived. :grin:



Helmbelly, glad you are enjoying your Rockwell. It is my impression that the Clausings are more desired, although it could simply be that they are better known. I see several Clausings for each Rockwell that turns up.
The Rockwell mills have several advantages primarily having about 1" greater travel in all directions, and an R-8 spindle. The main advantage of the Clausing is the ability to swing the head (both can tilt) and in my personal opinion the Clausing is the more attractive looking machine (always complement your dance partner ;) ).

As far as over paying or not that machine will likely outlive you. Even if you "overpaid" by $1000 in 10 years of use that adds up to a trip to Starbucks once a week and you sound happy with it. I also paid at the higher end of what these bring, but it came from somebody who is meticulous in the care of his tools and also came fairly well tooled. I am quite comfortable that I paid a fair price for it.
 
Did you go for the Clausing or Rock? I originally was after a Clausing - yes they have nice curb appeal, about as pretty as a machine gets. I dont need the swing head - in fact it was a negative as I did not want to tram something I would not use. R8 just makes life easier. But I would have got either brand, both baby bridgeports sorta, could do same work with either. This Rock just had my name on it. Could not agree more about the sticker price washing out. Over the 25-30 years I'll run this thing the money just does not matter. I wanted a good small mill.

Curious what tooling you got. Morbidly curious! I got a 4" Taiwan swivel vise that I like for 100. Ebayed a 3/8 and 1/2 collet, a 7/16 clamp set, and cheap asian drill chuck that has worked a charm. I had a vertex 8" rotary table. Picked up a 2nd indicator to tram the head, Shars parallels, and 123 blocks. That got me cutting metal. I already had end mills and I got a bunch more with the mill. Just picked up a set of angle blocks used Niagra corner rounding mill (1/2") for $20! I dont think it's ever been used. I have DRO, a 7 piece Shars collet set inbound now.

Today I was out testing surface finishes for an upcoming job. The calculators all say I should be running at 4-6000 rpm for alum (as far as I can tell) but my mill cuts 6061 beautifully at around 1200 rpm with a .5 EM and taking a good .150 cut. Hard to argue with results! I got it up to 2500 and a lot more noise but results no better. Gotta say I love having a mill!
 
I read that the 8520 Clausings came out first and the 8530's came out after 20 years as a redesign. They added some beef to the knee and I think gave it some more travel. That was the Clausing I was after, altho I dont do much heavy work, every extra bit of solid makes everything better. They are all small mills - and I lock off everything I can to keep vibration down. Mine is whisper quiet and super smooth after I got all the old grease out by adding a little oil consistently. I do grease the knee spline, but only oil everywhere else. I think maybe bolting the legs into my concrete pad may improve the overall 'rock steady".
 
I have an 8520.
The seller was someone I know who bought a Bridgeport, and I was lucky enough to be looking for a small mill when he was getting ready to sell the Clausing. It came with the factory power feed, a decent older import vise, a set of MT2 collets, drill chuck and a few other misc bits. It is in great shape for being 55 years old. A lot is made about R8 vs MT2 spindles, but I haven't had trouble finding MT2 tooling. The ones with the BS7 spindles might be more trouble to find tooling for.

I've got some Clausing literature and it looks like the 8530 came out in the late 60s so about 10 years after the 8520. It does have some improvements but appears to have been offered as a higher end machine, rather than a replacement.
On the 8530 the knee is redesigned and appears to be heavier, it also has a 2 speed hand crank on the right side, fast (I think 4-1) for quickly moving the table in the X axis and slow for precision movements. The 8520 just has a single speed crank. The 8530 came standard with the 4" column riser, which was an option on the 8520. Mine has the riser and it makes a big difference, only 11-5/8 spindle to table without the spacer which I think would be fairly cramped.
 
Good info. yeah thats how I tell them apart the beefed up knee on the 30's. The gent I bought my mill from had an 8520 in his museum basement. I went to it like a magnet. It's a bigger mill than I realized in photos, seems very well built. I still want one. I saw one go on ebay a year ago for 1500 that was in decent shape. There are three 8520 on right now and one 8530, all around 3K. Whats strange is that a year ago none of them were over 2K. They seem to have shot up in price. I think bc the hobbyist market has become more aware of what they are. But just a guess. No Rockwell's for sale on epay right now. They are a harder find. I use MT2 on my lathe tailstock so I agree MT2 is not an issue. How large of shank can you grab? With R8 they make 1" but people say dont put much of a load on them. My largest will be a 7/8 collet altho dont own anything past 3/4. So what kind of work do you use your Clausing on?
 
With your riser you come out just like a Rockwell at 16" which feels ample for my work envelope so far. What I use often is the fine feed for the quill. On the right I have a drill press style arm but on the left there is a fine feed wheel that is super handy with soft metal. It has about 4" of travel. I bring the table up to within a couple inches and work off the quill from there usually. I was lookin at the Clausings for sale last night and could not see a fine feed- how do you operate the your Z adjustments?
 
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