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Sheet metal shed for housing air compressor and a generator, any advices for ventilation and insulation

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GoceKU

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I have three partly finished sheet metal sheds in between my garages that use to be for storage of fire wood, this year i'm switching my heating system and i have two empty sheds to configure and make them more useful. I need some advice for insulation and ventilation, now if i leave any rubber parts in they turn to dust because of the heat, also one,( the smallest) shed needs to house an decent size air compressor, and a small to medium sized gasoline generator. I'll run underground air lines and power cables to connect the sheds to both garages to have compressed air from one compressor and emergency power to both houses .
 
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cg285

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the generator is easy, pipe the a/cleaner and exhaust outside.

don't know anything about northern shed needs tho
 

extropic

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Both the compressor and the generator are going to need a well ventilated space. They both breath air and are air cooled, yes?.

The compressor wants to be kept cool to allow the moisture in the hot compressed air to condense and precipitate.

If it freezes where you are, you'll want to insulate to protect the equipment from the low temps.

If the interior reaches 100°F or more in hot weather I would suggest a fan to draw exterior air in plus an adequate vent in the roof to let the hottest air out.
 
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cg285

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The compressor wants to be kept cool to allow the moisture in the hot compressed air to condense and precipitate.

It the interior reaches 100°F or more in hot weather I would suggest a fan to draw exterior air in plus an adequate vent in the roof to let the hottest air out.
i thought you kept the lines cool. i run mine in a zig zag fashion, on the wall (like a 1" pipe radiator), after the compressor, with a drum drip before it enters the building. i have very little moisture inside. i'm in a humid area.

what up with the fan, is it totally enclosed?
 

GoceKU

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Both the compressor and the generator are going to need a well ventilated space. They both breath air and are air cooled, yes?.
I almost overlooked that they are air cooled, the shed will be completely enclosed to keep the weather out, here summer temperatures can reach 40 degrees centigrade and winters as low as -20 centigrade. So i'll be definitely looking for some vents and fan or two, i'm also concerned about the noise i'm in a suburban neighborhood very tightly populated, and having an sheet metal shed acting like a megaphone is a big worry.
 
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cg285

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wire it so the fan comes on when the equipment is turned on
 

extropic

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I almost overlooked that they are air cooled, the shed will be completely enclosed to keep the weather out, here summer temperatures can reach 40 degrees centigrade and winters as low as -20 centigrade. So i'll be definitely looking for some vents and fan or two, i'm also concerned about the noise i'm in a suburban neighborhood very tightly populated, and having an sheet metal shed acting like a megaphone is a big worry.
Please describe the compressor and the generator so we know if we're talking about Chihuahuas or Wolves.

The 40C isn't a big problem but, the -20C is a killer if you don't prepare properly.
Do you have access to rigid foam insulation panels (RFIP) in your part of the world?

Rigid Foam Insulation Panel Examples

Covering the interior with panels will greatly attenuate the noise also.
The biggest noisemaker on a reciprocating compressor is usually the air intake. You might try plumbing the intake filter into an insulated box, inside the shed, but vented to the exterior with insulated flexible duct.

Insulated Flexible Duct Examples

I suspect that the thickness of RFIP youl'd need to protect from -20C (do your research) will be impractical.
A low wattage heater replacing the oil drain plug in the compressor can keep the pump safe.
 

GoceKU

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The compressor is been modified so many times over the years that is considered DIY by now it uses truck air pump three phase motor and i have three 60 liter propane high pressure cylinders that i plan adding to the system for extra capacity, as for the generator for now i have small 2kw bosch unit, but i plan getting an 10-20kw diesel generator. We have rigid foam insulation panels (RFIP) here, which is the obvious choice but the sheet metal in corrugated which will leave me gaps, other thing i'm thinking about is maybe digging down in the ground, i need to concrete the floor eventually i may increase the ceiling height and being underground even slightly should help in the winters.
 

extropic

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Digging down won't help unless you protect the space from the ambient temperature. That's what the shed is for, no?
180 Liters is about 48 Gallons. You'll need to orient and plumb the propane cylinders so that the water condensate can be drained.
 
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cg285

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We have rigid foam insulation panels (RFIP) here, which is the obvious choice but the sheet metal in corrugated which will leave me gaps,.
spray foam, there are different size disposable kits so you can diy
 

GoceKU

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You'll need to orient and plumb the propane cylinders so that the water condensate can be drained.
I'll need to modify the tanks to add a drain and threaded inlet / outlet, feet but that is for the future, first need to adapt the space.
 

extropic

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I'll need to modify the tanks to add a drain and threaded inlet / outlet, feet but that is for the future, first need to adapt the space.
SAFETY ALERT: I don't know your personal level of aptitude, education or experience so, please don't be offended if the following is obvious to you. I need to add it here for the benefit of the uninitiated. Your propane cylinders once contained a fluid capable of exploding if an explosive fuel/air ratio is exposed to a source of ignition. No matter how well you purge or rinse them out, please do not weld or grind on the cylinders until you research and follow safe procedures.
 

NortonDommi

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Without going into theories of sound reduction and ventilation might I suggest having a look at foamed concrete? An alternative is Polystyrene lightweight concrete. The foamed concrete is better in many respects as it can be easily cast,(Polystyrene concrete needs to be under pressure as it sets), it is fireproof and has outstanding sound insulation properties, its density can be controlled for different applications and best of all is easy to do at home.
http://pelagic.wavyhill.xsmail.com/cellcrete_how.html will give an idea about what it is. HoneyDoCarpenter has another simple build and his experimant with shampoo as a foaming agent is a good one.
 

GoceKU

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I don't know your personal level of aptitude, education or experience so, please don't be offended
No offence, i should mention i know the risks of cutting on fuel vessels, and the cylinders will be prepared properly when the time comes.
NortonDommi, DIY foamed concrete and polystyrene is a good idea but i simply don't have the time to make them from scratch. A Friend who is a contractor suggested glass wool or stone wool first then polystyrene, but that doubles the price.
 

NortonDommi

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GoceKU, Sorry I wasn't aware of the time issue. My shed is tin but I've lined the walls with surplus,(as in free for the taking), MDF. As my compressor has been living back in with me due to removing old shed at back for a new one noise is noticeable outside so I only run during the day.
If I were a rich man, deedle diedel deedle diedle dum... Many things I would do if I only had money!

What is flexible sheeting worth? Something like that rubberized bitumen sheeting that gets used on roofs.
Having some mass and being flexible it would probably attenuate sound.
What I had was a concrete block box with sand filling the blocks an angle iron reinforced ply lid with capping blocks on it inside an old shed that was partially open with air in through a buried drum intake and a couple of old microwave oven fans blowing out side vents. Compressor intake was through about three feet of 4" ducting with a cooking range vent filter on the end. It was pretty quiet. I live in an urban area and had no complaints.
I have upgraded the compressor,(an old Ingersol-Rand type 30), to a larger 3-cyl. unit so need to do a rebuild hence new shed.
 

GoceKU

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Norton Dommie, a year ago i had a lot of time to spare, but i switched jobs and now i'm close to 70 work hours in my full time job a week, plus i have two part time jobs in between and the weekends, so very little time free. I'll see about the bitumen sheeting, that may be a good extra layer for the sides. Other thing i did not released is how much scrap and firewood i have in there, i may need to build me a trailer to get rid of it.
 

GoceKU

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I've spent every free minute last few weeks in clearing the sheds, i had to hire truck to move all the scrap and made multiple trips to the dump. Surprisingly the north side sheet metal had completely rusted out, so i removed it and the front side also was bad, couple kicks all fall down, so after few trips they vent to the dump, now i have a shed with only two sides and roof, i've bought couple square tubing and galvanised sheet metals for added bracing and making shelves on all sides. I'm also looking in to insolation and looking at sorting some sort of LED lighting.
 

GoceKU

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Little progress update, I've worked on and off on the sheds in my freetime, i added more supports with square tubing, also made a door frame and attached it. Last week i did manage to rivet on the northside sheet metal, which was small side but difficult because of tight space and steep terrain, i also managed to install LED lighting strips in both sheds i'll snap some pictures next time i'm working there.
 

GoceKU

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Last few days i've been working on the lower side of my property, where my shades are located, i've never managed the rain waters here. The big shed could flood and did flood when bigger storms come so i decided to remedy this before i install the new sheet metal and put it to use. I have drainage pipes in the ground but they are deep, so i had to dig by hand day and a half to get to them. Then i bought PVC pipes and fittings and plumed everything to drain as it should, you can see the feardes drain is in the middle of the lower side of my shed, i also installed one more to collect the water from the sidewalk also connected the storm drain from the roof. This was an unexpected work but i know i had to be done right sometime.
DSC_0177.JPG
 

brino

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doing it right will pay off in the long run.
 

GoceKU

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A Lot has happened since last update on this thread, mid summer i injured my back this changed lots of my plans and my living style. i had to change day job, now i'm traveling more but don't work so much physical work and don't work 12-16 hours a day like before, that leave me more free time but because of the injury i can't work, i have to rest but i did manage to get some work done on the big shed, first i welded in some tubing to the pipes that hold the sides and the roof, to make shelves on two of the sides, i installed some old wood boards i had and have about 24 meters of shelf space, then i started to attach the new galvanized sheet metal i bought, i used 4mm pop rivets and attach them with some help, it was very painful installing them with a injured back, but finally i had it closed up from all sides and installed a lock on the entry door and was ready to be used, but with my back i only managed to bring the light parts only and was held back because i had no electricity for the LED lights i installed, i run them on battery as they have an 24v input but batteries don't last long, so just this month i finally bought some cable, drilled a hole in the side of my house and run a 220v, single phase in the shead, where i installed a switched 6 plug socket, and two power adapters to power the led lights, i'll take some pictures to share.
 

GoceKU

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I've taken some pictures, you can see the back, the snow on the roof has dropped down on one side that has higher roof line, this part of the shed is added additional and i'll finish the front and insolation it next year, for the part that i finish is the farthest in the first picture, some snow has gotten in also you can see how i've recently installed switched power plug and the led lights
IMG_20190112_093750.jpgIMG_20190110_183209.jpgIMG_20190110_183219.jpgIMG_20190110_183236.jpg
 

brino

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The steel interior is so shiny it helps with the lighting.
That is some definite progress.

I hope your physical recover goes well.

-brino
 
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