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Spindle longer than the barrel.

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rock_breaker

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#1
My neighbor wants a muzzle brake (recoil reducer?) on a 0.223 barrel that he brought to the shop. He also brought a piece of 1.25 diameter aluminum that he thought could be threaded on his experimental (second hand) barrel. We talked about "silencers" a bit: I told him silencers were illegal but I would attempt a muzzle brake. My nephew has a rifle equipped with a muzzle brake similar to a military rifle. All of this leads to some questions that I need help with. I started this project some time ago but it has been on hold due to illness in the family and a slipping tailstock on my lathe. As I recall someone referenced me to specifications and drawings for this device, perhaps they may be kind enough to do it again. Otherwise here are some questions.
1. Is there an advantage to 4 vents as opposed to 2?
2. Can the vents be 0.25" in diameter orientated on the sides of the barrel at (according to CAD) 0 and 180 degrees?
3. My nephew told me the vents should be angled 31` away from the shooter or 59` away from the projectile travel line. Is this correct?
4. How much larger than the caliber should the exiting hole for the projectile be?
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
Ray
 

Tozguy

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#2
The bore of the muzzle brake should be at least .020'' larger than the bullet, say .243'' for a .223.
As far as design goes it depends on the rifle and use intended.
I have a preference for several small holes (vents) around the full circumference of the brake although I have never considered that a 223 needs a brake. A brake does not help accuracy on a 223 and might hurt it.
If 'looks' is important then design it to be cool looking. Bear in mind that large holes out each side can be a nuisance to other shooters at the range.
There might be more advantages to making a barrel tuner out of that piece of aluminum.
 
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Tozguy

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#3
The title of the thread does not seem to relate to the content, what am I missing?
 

rock_breaker

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The title of the thread does not seem to relate to the content, what am I missing?
What is a barrel tuner?
I am curious about using aluminum centers to support the barrel and hoped what is used to protect the barrel would come up. I do have a threaded outboard spindle that I have made a center for that could support the chamber end inside the spindle.
The muzzle of the barrel is .875 + and I am thinking 7/8" x 14 tpi threads.
Have a good day
Ray
 

Tozguy

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#5
These fellas explain it better than I could.
http://www.targetshooter.co.uk/?p=660

I think I get it but the barrel might not seat properly on soft aluminum centers. I would use steel centres and preferably a ball bearing (live?) center in the tailstock. You should not be cutting centre dimples in either the chamber end or the muzzle end of the barrel. What about making tight fitting brass plugs with a centre dimple for the chamber end and one for the muzzle end. Then the centres would seat on the brass instead of on the barrel itself.
 

FarmDad

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#6
Just a side note ... In the U.S.A. standard threading for .22 caliber firearms is 1/2x28 . In europe it is 1/2x20 in the examples i have seen ( cz rimfires ) . You might want to thread it to standard so that the muzzle device is easily replaceable as wanted/needed .
I would ( if possible ) hang the barrel on centers so that the threading is concentric with the actual bore of the rifle rather than the profile of the barrel which likely will be out of line with the bore . If its not possible to use centers then make a tight fitting plug for the bore and indicate off it .
 

rgray

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#7
. What about making tight fitting brass plugs with a centre dimple for the chamber end and one for the muzzle end. Then the centres would seat on the brass instead of on the barrel itself.
I do this for turning barrel tapers. Never thought about using these centers for threading. I haven't threaded for muzzle breaks but I guess it may work for that. My threading has been for receiver threads and I wouldn't trust that method there. I blue loctite the brass insert into the barrel to keep it spinning with the barrel.
With the camber end in the headstock and the muzzle protruding out from a 4 jaw chuck, a ring made from 12 ga copper wire can be put around the barrel and the chuck jaws clamped on that to keep from marrying a spot on the barrel with chuck jaws.
 

rock_breaker

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#8
Thanks guys. Have some brass (irrigation valve stems) that I can make close fitting inserts for chamber and muzzle. Will put center dimples in these and a live center in the tailstock for the muzzle end. I use copper from frozen copper tubing for jaw softeners. Would a spent brass cartridge be suitable for the chamber?
Ray
 

Tozguy

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A spent cartridge case would not be a good enough fit in the chamber because it springs back a bit after firing. Also, the primer pocket might not be concentric. The case wall is rather thin and might not hold the pressures from turning. Granted the chamber end is less critical when cutting at the muzzle but it would be better to use the valve stems to make inserts.
If you are turning the barrel between centres what are the copper jaw softeners for? the drive dog?
 

Bamban

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#10
Why not thread in the headstock?

He gave you an aluminum stock (don't know how long it is) cut an internal thread to match the barrel tenon, screw the two pieces together. Basically making a long barrel extension. If you have an outboard spider you can then chuck up the barrel and use a long reach dial indicator and dial in the bore. You can use your 4J and a copper ring, or a front spider or whatever scheme you normally use to chamber a barrel.

Thread away.
 

rock_breaker

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#11
A spent cartridge case would not be a good enough fit in the chamber because it springs back a bit after firing. Also, the primer pocket might not be concentric. The case wall is rather thin and might not hold the pressures from turning. Granted the chamber end is less critical when cutting at the muzzle but it would be better to use the valve stems to make inserts.
If you are turning the barrel between centres what are the copper jaw softeners for? the drive dog?
Yes they are for the drive dog and 4J marking up the barrel and aluminum for the muzzle brake. Have some brass that my work for protecting internal barrel holding. Right now the aluminum is mounted in the 4 jaw and protected by copper.
Not sure how to mount an outboard spider on the chamber end of the barrel when it is inside the spindle Bamban. I have made a center that may give me enough room to thread the muzzle just outside the 4 jaw. At this point I'm gathering do and don't information about this project. I am getting some good info on barrel alignment and protection.
Have a good day
Ray
 
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