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Tool and cutter grinder build

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Bill Gruby

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#61
You have done well with the Micrometer adjustment Mark. Did you stay with two thrust bearings or go to one?

"Billy G"
 

mark_f

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#62
You have done well with the Micrometer adjustment Mark. Did you stay with two thrust bearings or go to one?

"Billy G"
Actually , no thrust bearings. I modified the Quorn micrometer by adding a steel ball bearing ball to each end and a stout spring. I can adjust the micrometer fairly easy but I can't overcome the spring by hand. If by chance I somehow did manage to overcome the spring, It would be away from the wheel. I felt this added some safety, but then that is some of my paranoid OCD :nuts:.
Micrometer Details.jpg The thimble has enough tension from the two ball bearings to stay in place when the micrometer is adjusted but i can overcome the tension easy enough to set zero. I wont need a screw lock I don't believe.
Micrometer Assembly .jpg There will be a steel ball between the end cap and the spring. The 1/2-20 thread gave me .050" per turn so there is about .100" between each graduation on the dial and one mark is .001" so I can pretty well judge to .0005" on the micrometer.


I am making new drawings for each step so I have drawings to match mt build when finished. I have been making a lot of changes. Things heavier and more rigid, longer base, and simplifying some things. I find the Bonell is kind of over engineered in some aspects.

Micrometer Assembly .jpg Micrometer Details.jpg
 

mark_f

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#63
I like the changes you are making, as I think this will make the grinder more stable and robust. This is going to get interesting! :)

You are at the top of the list for the altered prints when the grinder is done.
 

mark_f

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#64
Not a lot done today. I cut and polished the two support bars for the base.

Base parts.jpg These are the bars cut and polished. I also cut out the front and back plates for the work head and got them all laid out for drilling and milling. I also laid out the pocket that gets milled in the sliding base.

new shop.jpg Since the shop is so cold, I high jacked the kitchen table and moved it to my bed room so I can work on the grinder in a warm environment. I can work here laying out and measuring, then go to the shop to do the cutting.

I spent 5 hours today sorting through and editing prints. That is tedious work, takes a lot of time, but it has to be done. I erase half the crap on the prints that doesn't need to be there or That I don't need an add my own crap that I am changing. I am going to make a fixture tomorrow for my rotary table to mill the curved slots in the front plate.

Base parts.jpg new shop.jpg
 

mark_f

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#65
Well boys and girls, I got quite a bit done today. The fact that I loctited the base unit together is kind of a milestone. The base is about 98% completed. Now we are working on the good stuff. :rubbinghands:
Loc-tite bars and ends.jpg I was ready to Loc-tite the rear bar and base ends. I used Loc-tite bearing mount. It has a tensile strength of 4000 psi and is very permanent. It must be heated to 500 degrees to get apart and still won't be easy. They say it is as good as welding almost. I put the loc-tite on the bar ends and in the end plate holes, gave a quarter twist and set the assembly on my surface plate supporting the bars only. This aligns the bars perfectly parallel in the horizontal plane. They are aligned in the other directions by the precision bored holes that were bored with the ends bolted together. The holes have about .001" clearance. The loc-tite set in an hour to handle the part. It will completely cure in 24 hours. This stuff is amazing. After setting up, the base sets level on a flat surface and the micrometer bar "floats " smoothly, just like it should.:))

bottom view of base.jpg This photo shows the adjustable bar and the support bar on the bottom side of the base. The support bar is a 3/8" square steel bar bolted to the bottom. The rear sliding body stop sets against this bar to keep the head from falling forward toward the operator. The plans have a fixed stop, but I want mine adjustable so I will be installing a mini version of the rocker arm to be able to adjust this position. That comes a little later.

bottom view of completed base assembly.jpg This is a bottom view of the completed base unit with the adjustable bar, support bar and feet installed. I am using stainless steel button head socket screws for assembly. I think they look "pretty".

end view of base assembly.jpg This is the end view of the assembled base. The shiny cap on the left holds the micrometer spring in place and the one on the right is just for looks to cover the end of the Loc-tited bar.

Adjustment screws for adjustable bar.jpg This photo shows the adjustment screws for the adjustable bar. The taller one threads into the bar to pull it upwards and the shorter one threads into the end bar to limit the travel. The two combined lock the end of the bar in position. Now, I just know,someone is going to ask me why this bar is adjustable. And " I DON"T REALLY KNOW", I have wondered the same thing for a long time and only a few days ago found what I believe is the answer. I found a document discussing the Bonelle grinder and it makes mention of the "adjustable bar". The rocker arm rides on this bar with an adjustable micrometer stop. the article says the bar is adjustable to grind some sort of angle on tools, but I am still looking for more info on that. I always assumed it was adjustable to be able to get it exactly parallel to the micrometer bar, which is important it is.

adjustable bar and screws.jpg Another photo of the adjustable bar and the adjustment screws.

bottom view of completed base assembly.jpg This photo is the complete base assembly with the bars and feet.

complete grinder base.jpg This is a photo of the complete base assembly with the sliding base (under construction) mounted to check for fit.

paper patterns.jpg Now the fun stuff begins. MAKING THE WORK HEAD! I rough machined the sliding base unit several days ago. I cut some paper templates for the front and rear plates to check the fit before cutting any steel.

Paper paterns for front and rear plates.jpg The paper fits so I laid out the steel and went to work with my band saw.

front and rear plates cut and drilled.jpg These are the plates rough cut and drilled . That tab on the bottom of the rear plate will be cut off. It is the mechanical limit stop for the work head movement toward the operator. I don't like it so I will be making an adjustable one. I already have it figured out.

setup for drilling plates.jpg I clamped the plates together prior to drilling the bolt holes and used a 3/8" drill to check the pivot hole alignment. It spins freely so I can drill the bolt holes in the plates.

drilling rear plate bolt holes.jpg I used my drill pres to drill the bolt holes.

rear plate on sliding base.jpg The plates fit perfectly.

checking fit of sling base plates.jpg AND THE PIVOT HOLES ARE STILL IN ALIGNMENT! :bitingnails:( I was worried about this step)

The fellows over at the Quorn site seem to think it takes 600 hours to build this grinder. I don't know, maybe it does. I have 62 hours in it so far. I am keeping a build log for time and also creating a material list as I go. ( I'm sure someone is going to ask if there is one).

Well , We will see what tomorrow brings.

checking fit of sling base plates.jpg drilling rear plate bolt holes.jpg front and rear plates cut and drilled.jpg Paper paterns for front and rear plates.jpg paper patterns.jpg rear plate on sliding base.jpg setup for drilling plates.jpg adjustable bar and screws.jpg Adjustment screws for adjustable bar.jpg bottom view of base.jpg bottom view of completed base assembly.jpg complete grinder base.jpg end view of base assembly.jpg Loc-tite bars and ends.jpg
 
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wrmiller

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#66
Hey Mark,

I'm just asking for the materials list. A log of your hours doing various parts of this project would just show me how slow and inexperienced I am. :lmao:
 

mark_f

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#67
Hey Mark,

I'm just asking for the materials list. A log of your hours doing various parts of this project would just show me how slow and inexperienced I am. :lmao:

Oh, I know that. The hours log is mostly for me. I am interested in how long it actually takes to build. Some of the guys at the quorn site seem to think it is a life long project :roflmao::roflmao:
 

NEL957

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#68
Mark
Looking very good, watching all your improvements. Love all you have done and the courage to get back at my Quorn.
Looking forward to the next entry.
Nelson Collar
 

mark_f

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#69
Got a little bit done today.

pocket milled in sliding base.jpg I milled the pocket in the side of the sliding base today. This provides clearance for the indicator arm. I free hand cut this pocket on a milling machine by turning both the x and y axis at the same time ( one hand on each wheel).

indicator arm.jpg This is the indicator arm, made from 1/8" steel plate. It attaches to the tilting head and fits in the clearance pocket milled in the sliding base. It shows the tilt angle and locks the tilting head in place.

rear plate and lock nut.jpg I also made the lock nut that fits the rear side of the rear plate and threads onto the pivot pin that supports and locks the tilting head in position.

rearplate and lock nut 2.jpg This photo shows the nut in place. It is held in position on the rear plate by a 1/8" dowel pin that keeps it from rotating

boring tilting bracket.jpg I cut a piece of 2" x 2" steel bar to make the tilting head. put it in the 4 jaw chuck and turned the boss for the rotating base. It then needed a .500" hole in it to hold the rotating base shaft. I left the hole .002" undersized and will hone it to fit when I make the shaft.

cutting seat.jpg The next item is the 90 degree seat at the top of the boss. This seat holds the rotating base to the tilting bracket. All this had to be done in one setup to keep all surfaces concentric. I used a rounded tool I had for cutting a radius. It left a nice smooth finish on the seat.

sawing excess material.jpg With the tilting bracket roughed out, I used my band saw to cut the excess material off and finished milled the side to size.

tilting head roughed out.jpg This is the roughed out tilting bracket. it still needs angles cut on the ends and several holes and two milled slots yet. Maybe tomorrow.

boring tilting bracket.jpg cutting seat.jpg indicator arm.jpg pocket milled in sliding base.jpg rear plate and lock nut.jpg rearplate and lock nut 2.jpg sawing excess material.jpg tilting head roughed out.jpg
 

mark_f

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#70
Any you guys out there bearing experts. I was talking to motion industries about precision bearings for my spindle. I thought they had to have spacers and springs to preload them. The guy says the precision bearings are preloaded out of the package and only need a spacer between them. I thought he might be a little :nuts:. It would sure make construction easy. any of you know anything about this? I want to know for sure before I buy something, So I need to do more research on this :thinking: because if this was true, why do all these spindle prints show precision spacers and springs to load the bearings.
:noidea:
 

cjtoombs

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#71
Looking forward to seeing this build. I have looked at both the Bonelle and the Quorn myself. I wound up finding a great deal on a KO Lee T&C grinder, so I am no longer in need of either of these, but if I ever downsize my garage, one would be handy. If you need a book on operating one, a KO Lee manual for one of these machines has a very comprehensive set of instructions for just about anything you will want to grind.
 

mark_f

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#72
Looking forward to seeing this build. I have looked at both the Bonelle and the Quorn myself. I wound up finding a great deal on a KO Lee T&C grinder, so I am no longer in need of either of these, but if I ever downsize my garage, one would be handy. If you need a book on operating one, a KO Lee manual for one of these machines has a very comprehensive set of instructions for just about anything you will want to grind.
Yea, I been thinking about that. I suppose I'll have to make a bunch of accessories to grind tools and also have to figure out how to do it .:veryscared:
 

cjtoombs

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#73
Yea, I been thinking about that. I suppose I'll have to make a bunch of accessories to grind tools and also have to figure out how to do it .:veryscared:
I found the manual one ebay, I have ordered other manuals from this guy and they are very good quality. The accessories are the only reason the one I bought was a good deal, I got the machine with most of the available accessories for about the cost of the accessories by themselves. I looked for one for a long time, and they never came with any tooling, and the tooling to make a T&C grinder useful tends to be expensive. There are quite a few of accessories for the Quorn described in its book, I expect they could easily adapted to the one you are building.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/K-O-LEE-Uni...310?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43ae1ab386
 

fastback

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#74
I have been following this build and you are doing a wonderful job. If nothing else I'll learn how to take my time. Doing some of the work in the bedroom really brings meaning to "I'll sleep on it". Great job, really looking forward to seeing more.

Paul
 

mark_f

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#75
I did some machining on the tilting bracket today and temporarily assembled the parts to see how they fit and look.

test fit work head parts.jpg All looks good, so now to finish these parts and get them assembled for good.

test fit work head parts.jpg
 

mark_f

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#76
I FINALLY DID IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WP_20150126_22_10_39_Pro.jpg I got the micrometer put together. It only took an hour and a half. :rofl: :rofl: There are also two little steel ball bearings somewhere on my floor , never to be seen again. :panic: ( I was smart, needed two , bought six). I realize this don't look all that big a deal till you try to hold those two balls in the hole in the screw with the spring between them and put the thimble on at the same time. I spent most of the time looking for little steel balls that shot out and bounced off something and rolled away. The darn thing works great though. The balls ride in a groove in the thimble keeping pressure on it, tight enough to follow the screw when it is turned, but still easy to re-position for "zero" when desired. A thumb screw lock is not needed. I wasn't sure this was going to work, but I am really impressed with this design. ( sometimes it don't take a lot to impress me :nuts:) My wife was watching this ( I think she is still laughing)

Micrometer Assembly .jpg The print will give you a vision of how it works.

WP_20150126_22_10_39_Pro.jpg Micrometer Assembly .jpg
 

herbet999

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#77
nice.. did you have to use two different knurl wheels for the two different diameters?
 

mark_f

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#78
nice.. did you have to use two different knurl wheels for the two different diameters?
Naw......I just have the cheap one. Knurling for me is a shot in the dark. Sometimes it works and most times it's crappy :rofl:. A friend recently showed me how to knurl better.
 

NEL957

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#79
Mark
Sorry you lost your ball. There is a remedy for that, and that is a drop of Loctite, works well.
Keep up the nice work, it's starting to look really nice.
Nelson Collar
 

mark_f

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#80
I spent a few hours in my friends shop today to work on the grinder ( mine was too cold....18 degrees today ). My goal was ( which I did achieve), to do the finish machining on the lower half of the work head.

milling slots 2.jpg
milling slots.jpg I really wanted to get the curved slots milled in the front plate. I did this on the rotary table. To make it easy, I went to my shop yesterday and set my lathe up to make an MT2 taper with a 3/4" blank end on it. Once rolling , I cranked out a half a dozen of them. They will be used as tooling for my rotary table. I chucked one up and turned a .375" stub on the end. The center hole in my rotary table is MT2. I chucked the stub in the mill spindle and lowered the spindle with the stub into the rotary table till it was snug, locked the spindle and tightened the clamps for holding the rotary table in place. Presto! it is automatically centered to within 1 or 2 thousandths. ( I read about this somewhere and it saves so much time). The hole in my plate is .375", so I just put it on the stub that I left in the center of the table, clamped the part down and it is set to mill. No indicator required. As you can see in the photos, I just cranked the mill table out the amount of my radius and milled the slot. the whole process took about 20 minutes. I will save this stub and make a bushing for what ever diameter I need and put it on the stub and my part is located as soon as I set it on the table.

I also drilled a few more holes in the base blocks for split cotter clamps. I have decided to use them instead of pinch bolts in split holes for locks. Everyone says they are better, but sure are a lot more work to make. With any luck , I can permanently assemble the lower half of the work head soon.

milling slots 2.jpg milling slots.jpg
 

rwm

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#81
Mark,
How did you do the markings on the micrometer? Did I miss that?
When you plunge the end mill like above, do you have a pre-drilled hole? of just make it with the end mill?
R
 

mark_f

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#82
Mark,
How did you do the markings on the micrometer? Did I miss that?
When you plunge the end mill like above, do you have a pre-drilled hole? of just make it with the end mill?
R
There was some information on the markings.I use my lathe with a boring bar to scratch the line. It is earlier in the thread. I use a degree wheel to index.

I just plunged that hole because I had a center cutting end mill. Otherwise you have to drill first.
 

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#83
Mark,

Excelent craftsmanship! I am following this with great interest, as I found Bills build after it was complete.
For several years I have considered building a cutter grinder the size of a bread box.
My needs are to sharpen horizontal cutters up to 4 inch O.D. and end mills.

I havent got off center yet as I have a full size industrial T&G. But that is the problem its HUGE and in the way.

I do have two questions about this Bonelle design concept that I don't understand.

1) With so many adjustments, how are the various axies brought exactly to "Zero"? {Question defined as adjusting precisely "Parallel or Square" to the grinding wheel.}

2) I understand how to use a Deckel, as well as an Industrial tool grinder. With the Bonelle design, how are the spiral flutes of an endmill ground?

Keep up the good work!

Restorer
 

mark_f

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#84
Mark,

Excelent craftsmanship! I am following this with great interest, as I found Bills build after it was complete.
For several years I have considered building a cutter grinder the size of a bread box.
My needs are to sharpen horizontal cutters up to 4 inch O.D. and end mills.

I havent got off center yet as I have a full size industrial T&G. But that is the problem its HUGE and in the way.

I do have two questions about this Bonelle design concept that I don't understand.

1) With so many adjustments, how are the various axies brought exactly to "Zero"? {Question defined as adjusting precisely "Parallel or Square" to the grinding wheel.}

2) I understand how to use a Deckel, as well as an Industrial tool grinder. With the Bonelle design, how are the spiral flutes of an endmill ground?

Keep up the good work!

Restorer
With regards to the adjustment for zero, with the scales and some micrometer attachments that are made, it is not a problem setting everything to zero.

There is a finger rest for grinding flutes and made much better with use of an air bearing spindle.
 

wrmiller

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#85
Hey Mark,

Are you incorporating a air bearing type spindle into your design?
 

NEL957

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#86
Mark
I got a email from the company in England and the fella there said that they just use bearing from an alternator. They would do a fine job and you do not need hundred dollar bearings.
Nelson
 
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mark_f

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#89
I had found some info on making an air bearing once, but can't find it now.they are kinda expensive to buy , so I wouls like to attempt one. if anyone has any info about them , let me know
 

cjtoombs

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#90
I had found some info on making an air bearing once, but can't find it now.they are kinda expensive to buy , so I wouls like to attempt one. if anyone has any info about them , let me know
From all I've read about them, the clearances are quite tight. If I were going to make one myself, I would probably try a piece of TGP round for the spindle and check to make sure it's size was uniform to a tenth or two, then I would rough in the spindle housing and take it to an automotive machine shop and have it finished on a Sunnen hone. I used to run one when I worked at a shop and you can get very tight clearances with straight uniform holes on one of those machines, if operated correctly.
 
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