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Who owns a Grizzly 4003 lathe from 1999 to 2005 ?

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Mutt

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#1
Need a copy of the wiring diagram for the forward/reverse switch. Lost my book, Grizzly has had 3 totally different type switches since 1999.
I'm in the process of installing a good USA made rotary drum switch on my 4003. It's a1999 model I bought brand new. Geez, I can't believe how cheaply made some of the components on this lathe are. Didn't their parents teach them that if something is worth doing, it's worth doing right. ????
 

Superburban

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#2
Have you tried E-mailing grizzly? I know I have a couple different versions of their manual saved here somewhere, I'll look for them, and see if they have a date.
 

Mutt

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#3
Grizzly doesn't save obsolete stuff, then they try to sell ya stuff that is "upgraded" from the newer model. But the stuff rarely fits with machine work to it. Hope ya can find teh diagram. My lathe is down until I get the wiring diagram to install a switch
 

jmanatee

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#4
I think I have a 2000 G4003 ( I am not sure how to find exact year, I bought it used), my manual doesn't have any wiring diagrams, but the online PDF does have detailed wiring diagrams. I am not sure how much the wiring has changed even if the switch did.
 

markba633csi

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#5
Single cap or dual cap motor? That's the main difference, and modern diagrams are available; I/we can walk you thru it
mark
 

Mutt

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#6
I think I have a 2000 G4003 ( I am not sure how to find exact year, I bought it used), my manual doesn't have any wiring diagrams, but the online PDF does have detailed wiring diagrams. I am not sure how much the wiring has changed even if the switch did.


Here is the page from Grizzly talking about the latest update.
https://cdn0.grizzly.com/manuals/g4003_m.pdf
 

Mutt

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#7

Mutt

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#8
It's a single cap on top of motor. The start is a set of centrifigal points on the motor end cover. I'm guessing the cap is for RUN only. I will use this drum switch I recently bought

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Reversing-Drum-Dayton-Switch-2X441-Single-Phase-Poly-Phase/153253775585?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Here are some pics of the tear down. Maybe one of you electricians can decipher this mess for me? Lathe is 220v 1 ph. 2hp

Here is where the cheap plastic switches are. This was the original start switch set up,
then they changed to a mini rotary switch, now to 2 limit switches
DSC02824.JPG

cheap plastic junk
DSC02825.JPG

wires removed from old switch
from bottom to top of pic
red jumper
green/yellow ground
red #4
blue #5
black #6
brown #7
DSC02826.JPG
new rotary switch
DSC02827.JPG
diagrams inside of cover
DSC02830.JPG
DSC02829.JPG
off
DSC02831.JPG
forward
DSC02833.JPG
reverse
DSC02832.JPG
 
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Mutt

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#9
on the revised set up, the wires are all the same colors, but 2 of the numbers have been swapped

original wires (As seen above pic)

red jumper
green/yellow ground
red #4
blue #5
black #6
brown #7

new wiring

red jumper
green/yellow ground
red is now #7
blue #5
black is now #4
brown #7

perhaps these 2 wires make the switch reverse it's directions on the handle?
 

pdentrem

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#10
Same switch as on our Jet BDB-1340A. The manual is available on line if interested.
 

markba633csi

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#11
From the pictures you posted the red actually looks more like yellow, but anyhow:
I think brown + black is the power pair and blue + yellow (red) is the motor pair. Or vise-versa.
I was going to post a possible hookup but it looks like it wouldn't have worked- I need to study the new manual a bit more
I shall return
Mark
 
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Mutt

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#12
From the pictures you posted the red actually looks more like yellow, but anyhow:
I think brown + black is the power pair and blue + yellow (red) is the motor pair. Or vise-versa.
I was going to post a possible hookup but it looks like it wouldn't have worked- I need to study the new manual a bit more
I shall return
Mark






Ok, so I hooked up my original wires like shown on this new diagram using the colors, , (not by the numbers on my original wires)
Plugged the power back in and flipped the drum switch forward, nothing, Reverse nothing. If I flip the drum switch in either direction and push the lathe ON button and hold it in, the chuck turns. If I let off the ON button everything stops

switch wiring.jpg
 

markba633csi

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#13
Yea I'm not surprised, that drawing above won't have any relation to your drum switch, it actually represents a pair of spdt microswitches
 

jmanatee

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#14
Isn't the motor controlled by two 24v contactors, one for forward, one for reverse. so isn't this forward reverse switch just a low voltage switch?
 

jmanatee

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#15
I think the power button (not estop) should latch the third contactor.
 

Mutt

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#16
Yea I'm not surprised, that drawing above won't have any relation to your drum switch, it actually represents a pair of spdt microswitches


So I might have to get rid of the buttons on the "switch board" on the lathe's front,
Left is KILL button, I'd need that,
the next is ON ,
the next is Jog (which I never use any way)
and last, the light that tells ya the machine is on. (which I also don't need)

What would be my next step? I have seen this switch on all kinds of lathes, drill presses, mills, etc. I am sure it can be used on this . The micro rotary drum switch, which Grizzly used (for an undetermined amount of time) is basically a mini version of this Dayton drum switch
 

markba633csi

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#17
It should be possible to use the drum switch in place of the old plastic switch, but the circuit is a bit convoluted- I'm sure one of us can figure it out but it might take a couple days, hang in there
mark
Mutt: can you take a super close up pic of the old switch and show how it was connected? That would be a big help
 
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jmanatee

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#18
Can you test for 24v AC on the black wire at the switch to ground (green and yellow)
 

Superburban

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#19
I still have to dig out my old computer, but from what I see, you are trying to switch from one style switch, to another.

Going by Mutts diagram, the switches do the following:

Direction 1,____ 7 and 5 are connected.
Off,____________ 4 and 5 are connected.
Direction 2,_____4 and 6 are connected.

And of course the green is ground.

Maybe someone can decipher the right connections to get the drum switch to do the same things. When I get to the house, I'll check back in on here.


Is there more to this switch? where does the orange wire in the back go?

 
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Mutt

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#20
Can you test for 24v AC on the black wire at the switch to ground (green and yellow)

Kill button out (the power will be ON) both thew black, and the brown wire, have 19v + AC. Kill button in (power OFF) black and brown both have 10v AC
 

Mutt

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#21
I still have to dig out my old computer, but from what I see, you are trying to switch from one style switch, to another.

Going by Mutts diagram, the switches do the following:

Direction 1 7 and 5 are connected.
Off, 4 and 5 are connected.
Direction 2 4 and 6 are connected.

And of course the green is ground.

Maybe someone can decipher the right connections to get the drum switch to do the same things. When I get to the house, I'll check back in on here.


Is there more to this switch? where does the orange wire in the back go?



The square end of the shaft that used to turn the motor on and off, had a plastic cam pressed onto the end of it. When ya raised or lowered the handle, it pushed the cam towards the switch, which would connect one set of contacts and the plastic cam would turn to close one or the other sets of contacts
 
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Mutt

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#22
It should be possible to use the drum switch in place of the old plastic switch, but the circuit is a bit convoluted- I'm sure one of us can figure it out but it might take a couple days, hang in there
mark
Mutt: can you take a super close up pic of the old switch and show how it was connected? That would be a big help


Unfortunately not. I didn't take a picture of the switch before I took the wires off today. That is one reason I was hoping someone had the owners manual from around 2000. It would show how those plastic switches were hooked up
 

pdentrem

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#23
These are from the manual for the Jet we bought around 2000. It uses the identical switch. image.jpg image.jpg
 
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jmanatee

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#24
What happens if you touch (quickly ) black to orange or black to blue One at a time?
 

Mutt

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#25
I stand corrected on the caps. The data plate on the motor says " Dual Capacitor induction motor" I remember about 5 or more years ago, I think one of the caps went out. It must not have been the run cap as I've been running it for that long since. If I remember right, I just removed the old cap, taped off the wires to it and left it at that. Guess I better find out what mf that lower cap is and get another while this lathe is down
 

Mutt

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#26
What happens if you touch (quickly ) black to orange or black to blue One at a time?


With the black and blue wires removed from the switch?or just a jumper wire?
 

jmanatee

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#27
Just a quick touch of black to orange, Listen for a contactor to close

Just a quick touch of black to blue, Listen for a contactor to close
 

jmanatee

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#28
I dont think it is going to work because I think you need the 3rd contactor to close 1st

This is done by estop out which powers start button, start button powers and latches on the 3rd contact. this powers the forward revers switch

It might not be 24vac when 3rd contact closes it might be 110v Man the diagrams are difficult to follow
 

Superburban

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#29
Here is from the 2008 edition for the G4003G gunsmith lathe. I think this is the switch you have.

I also attached the Shop fox version of the lathe. Probably the same wiring, but you never know. I can't find the older version of the 4003, I'll keep looking.

Have you checked with Grizzly, to see if the switch is still available? It may be cheesey, but it did last a good bit. Would be nice to have the saddle lever for stops, and starts.

switch1.PNG switch2.PNG
 

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Mutt

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#30
What happens if you touch (quickly ) black to orange or black to blue One at a time?

I jumped the red/black and the blue black and nothing happened. Then I tried the red black while holding the ON button. Nothing. Then the black blue holding the ON switch, nothing.

Then I turned the drum switch on to the forward position, jumped red black and held in the ON button and the motor turned CW.

If you hit the KILL button, then unlock the KILL button and flip the rotary switch in either direction nothing happens

If ya flip the rotary switch FORWARD and ya hold the ON button in, the motor will stay running until ya let go of the
ON button.

For a few times. I could flip the rotary switch in either direction and it would actually come on and stay on until I moved the rotary lever back to off. But when I kit the KILL button , I had to start all over again with this process.

IT has a mind of it's own right now. Some times it will go FORWARD on Forward, some times it will go CCW on forward ???? I don't see any kind of electornics on here. just junctions and contactors
 
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