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- Feb 13, 2017
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It seems this is a not uncommon desire, to overfill a too small breaker box. There are two different styles of SqD breakers, industrial and residential. One form will fit the other box, but costs a lot more. I will admit, the residential grade is new (to me) and I don't know it well.
The style/form of the existing breakers is "QO-120" and "QO-230", as an example. The "QO" is the designator for the breaker form, the "120" means single pole, 20 amp. The "230" means a two pole, 30 amp. Single pole being 120 volt and two pole being 240 volt. I won't go into that theory, see:
for more details. It's actually a small book, being about 50 pages PDF.
To take Capt Jas' original question, the following is how I would set it up. I am in a different state and used to working with older wire tables, so cannot be taken as the most appropriate way to do it. Just how I would do things.
The far right is a QO-230, that remains as is. The far right could be set up with QO-3030's, providing yet another 30 amp circuit.
The center two slots both get QO-1515 (or QO-2020). That is to carry the four 120 volt circuits that are currently in the box.
The far left gets two QO-3030. This provides 2 ea 30 amp 230 volt circuits. Watch how the circuits are connected, one leg to each breaker.
Very important: The breaker that feeds this "submain" must be sized for the wire used. There was mention of an AWG-8 wire. Per the "old" wire tables (ca.1990) I am familiar with, that is 40 amp wire. AWG-10 is 30 amp, AWG-12 is 20 amp. AWG-14 is 15 amp. This must be observed, that the breaker is rated at or lower than the wire.
Assuming the AWG-8 is the feed for this box, it is the limiting factor for all circuits combined. It cannot be exceeded, ever. The 30 amp 240 volt circuits should be used "one at a time". There was mention of a two to three phase converter being installed. Such a device is "tuned" to the motor connected and should not be shared. If two such devices are used, they should be on separate circuits. That is what the described panel is configured for.
There are other considerations involved, many more. Some are covered in the web link, others are available in the NEC code book. All in all, you would theoretically want an electrician experienced in the local codes to at least oversee the work. Re my reference about fires in the book... ... The bottom line, this entry must be considered in the context of its' presentation, an unknown source on a widely distributed web site. I am not liable for any damages from this text. However, I do release any and all information into the public domain.
I'm not sure I covered all the points asked about, but I did get the gist of it. I would advise that if the originator walks away from this configuration, that it be returned to its' original configuration.
The style/form of the existing breakers is "QO-120" and "QO-230", as an example. The "QO" is the designator for the breaker form, the "120" means single pole, 20 amp. The "230" means a two pole, 30 amp. Single pole being 120 volt and two pole being 240 volt. I won't go into that theory, see:
for more details. It's actually a small book, being about 50 pages PDF.
To take Capt Jas' original question, the following is how I would set it up. I am in a different state and used to working with older wire tables, so cannot be taken as the most appropriate way to do it. Just how I would do things.
The far right is a QO-230, that remains as is. The far right could be set up with QO-3030's, providing yet another 30 amp circuit.
The center two slots both get QO-1515 (or QO-2020). That is to carry the four 120 volt circuits that are currently in the box.
The far left gets two QO-3030. This provides 2 ea 30 amp 230 volt circuits. Watch how the circuits are connected, one leg to each breaker.
Very important: The breaker that feeds this "submain" must be sized for the wire used. There was mention of an AWG-8 wire. Per the "old" wire tables (ca.1990) I am familiar with, that is 40 amp wire. AWG-10 is 30 amp, AWG-12 is 20 amp. AWG-14 is 15 amp. This must be observed, that the breaker is rated at or lower than the wire.
Assuming the AWG-8 is the feed for this box, it is the limiting factor for all circuits combined. It cannot be exceeded, ever. The 30 amp 240 volt circuits should be used "one at a time". There was mention of a two to three phase converter being installed. Such a device is "tuned" to the motor connected and should not be shared. If two such devices are used, they should be on separate circuits. That is what the described panel is configured for.
There are other considerations involved, many more. Some are covered in the web link, others are available in the NEC code book. All in all, you would theoretically want an electrician experienced in the local codes to at least oversee the work. Re my reference about fires in the book... ... The bottom line, this entry must be considered in the context of its' presentation, an unknown source on a widely distributed web site. I am not liable for any damages from this text. However, I do release any and all information into the public domain.
I'm not sure I covered all the points asked about, but I did get the gist of it. I would advise that if the originator walks away from this configuration, that it be returned to its' original configuration.
Bill Hudson