Would a PM-1440E-LB make a good gunsmithing lathe?

Chip

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Seems like every time I am close to making a decision on the Grizzly G4003G something new comes up. Namely the PM-1440E-LB.

Given the choice between these two, which would be a better value?
 
Your really not comparing apples to apples with those two choices. A 12x36 vs. a 14x40 size. Different secondary gearbox styles. The two closer comparisons would be a Grizzly G0709 and the Precision Mathews PM1440E-LB. Those have the same secondary gearbox styles, whereas the G4003G has the Norton style gearbox for threading/IPR.

The 1440E-LB also has a 2" spindle bore compared to 1-9/16" on the G4003G.

Between the two you asked about I would probably go with the PM1440E-LB over the G4003G for the above reasons, but if you are comparing the PM1440E-LB to the G0709 it is about a toss up.

I hope other members who actually own either of these two will chime in and give real first have experience/opinions.
 
I'd go with the PM, IF it has a rear spider. If you want to do some serious gunsmithing work, you should have a spider. It allows you to truly dial in the bore when chambering and crowning.
Plus, the PM has a 3 year warranty, larger capacity, and is 400 pounds heavier. It also comes with a toolpost.
 
Gunsmithing isn't hard on a lathe. If both have comparable build quality and accuracy, that extra 400 lbs won't mean much. Unless you have other projects requiring heavier cuts than those typically done in normal gunsmithing, like making cannon or mortars. :)

But the other points made are valid. I guess you really have to make you choice based on what you want/need to do with the lathe. A Eisen 12x36 or PM 1340gt will more than fit the bill of a quality lathe that will handle rifle work (these are on my short list). You can make a spider.

Just my $0.02
Bill
 
Firstly, I'm NOT a gunsmith but bought the G4003G, a gun smithing lathe before knowing about PM. I've been very pleased with it but have had an issue or two. Mainly, the motor went TU just before the warranty expired. Grizzly was very prompt taking care of the issue and the head electrical tech gave me his private line to contact him directly because the replacement motor was not identical to the original unit. They were shipping stuff left and right (caps, relays, transformers and several parts I can't remember right now) to take care of the problem that only a motor replacement would do. In my book it's an excellent bang for the buck. If you can afford to stretch to the PM I'd not dissuade you. Many folks here are very pleased with them although they're not without their occasional hiccup as well (ask the folks that got metric machines when they ordered Imperial, stuff happens). As Mike suggested the PM machine he referenced does have a larger spindle bore. Are you gonna build cannons? The Grizzly does come equipped with a spider and brass tipped bolts for it. I've used mine only once but it worked as advertised. At one time I just knew there was an accuracy problem and I finally found it. In the mirror.:rofl: After investing in a DRO I found the dials to be spot on.

Now that I know a little bit more about what I'm doing I find it to be as accurate as the operator is. I turned three .001" interference fits today and after soaking the female part on the stove burner at lo-medium and the male in the freezer a little tap with my LFH sent it home. After returning to ambient temp, they ain't going anywhere. (Went ahead and pinned a .001" interference fit on one part anyway though. It was on an Ironhead!) I was able to turn the pin to 0.138" in one shot out of cold rolled.

I'm sure you could do all of the above with either machine as they both seem to have pretty solid reps. Might come down to budget. How much is one unit compared to the other?

P.S. I've been running machines ever since the day I got my lathe and the warranty expired June 12th past. :whistle:
 
I have the Grizzly G4003G. It has a spider, QCTP and can easily chamber a 22" barrel held in the 4 jaw and spider. The Norton gear box allows it to go down to .0011/rev on the longitudinal feed. It also has a D1-5 camlock which has 6 pins if that helps with rigidity in the chuck.

The PM also has QCTP, D1-5 camlock, and the spindle length should get you down to a 22" barrel though it looks like you need to add a spider. The specs say it can achieve .0006"/rev on the logitudinal feed which is plenty slow. It weighs 600 pounds more. Seems like a great machine.
Dave
 
First off, thank you all from the bottom of my heart for taking the time to help me with my questions. Seriously, I really appreciate it.

Considering what has been mentioned above, maybe my focus doesn't point to a gunsmithing lathe necessarily. I have an interest in gunsmithing to some degree, but I am no benchrest shooter. My focus would be more on re-profiling a barrel, cutting muzzle threads, crowning a barrel. My interest in the gunsmithing lathe was the perceived quality and accuracy and large numbers of previous buyers reviews. Figure actual gunsmithing as 30% of my use. Actually, the ability to chuck up a 2" dia tube inside the spindle and fab my own hydraulic cylinder would be pretty darn cool. I am also guessing that a DRO is coming sooner or later regardless of what I buy. Otherwise the frustration level as well as the scrap pile would likely get too deep. That added expense on the 1236 now separates the two apples to apples by $800. Also noticed the 1440e-lb is almost 500lbs heavier.

The Eisen 1236GH looks exactly like the G4003G. (wonder if both are made in Taiwan?)

Decisions, decisions...
 
First off, thank you all from the bottom of my heart for taking the time to help me with my questions. Seriously, I really appreciate it.

Considering what has been mentioned above, maybe my focus doesn't point to a gunsmithing lathe necessarily. I have an interest in gunsmithing to some degree, but I am no benchrest shooter. My focus would be more on re-profiling a barrel, cutting muzzle threads, crowning a barrel. My interest in the gunsmithing lathe was the perceived quality and accuracy and large numbers of previous buyers reviews. Figure actual gunsmithing as 30% of my use. Actually, the ability to chuck up a 2" dia tube inside the spindle and fab my own hydraulic cylinder would be pretty darn cool. I am also guessing that a DRO is coming sooner or later regardless of what I buy. Otherwise the frustration level as well as the scrap pile would likely get too deep. That added expense on the 1236 now separates the two apples to apples by $800. Also noticed the 1440e-lb is almost 500lbs heavier.

The Eisen 1236GH looks exactly like the G4003G. (wonder if both are made in Taiwan?)

Decisions, decisions...

Actually the Grizzly G4003G is a Chinese lathe. The Eisen 1236GH is more comparable to the Precision Mathews PM1340GT just a little smaller. Both Eisen and PM are Taiwanese as origin and quality.
 
First off, thank you all from the bottom of my heart for taking the time to help me with my questions. Seriously, I really appreciate it.

Considering what has been mentioned above, maybe my focus doesn't point to a gunsmithing lathe necessarily. I have an interest in gunsmithing to some degree, but I am no benchrest shooter. My focus would be more on re-profiling a barrel, cutting muzzle threads, crowning a barrel. My interest in the gunsmithing lathe was the perceived quality and accuracy and large numbers of previous buyers reviews. Figure actual gunsmithing as 30% of my use. Actually, the ability to chuck up a 2" dia tube inside the spindle and fab my own hydraulic cylinder would be pretty darn cool. I am also guessing that a DRO is coming sooner or later regardless of what I buy. Otherwise the frustration level as well as the scrap pile would likely get too deep. That added expense on the 1236 now separates the two apples to apples by $800. Also noticed the 1440e-lb is almost 500lbs heavier.

The Eisen 1236GH looks exactly like the G4003G. (wonder if both are made in Taiwan?)

Decisions, decisions...

Actually the Grizzly G4003G is a Chinese lathe. The Eisen 1236GH is more comparable to the Precision Mathews PM1340GT just a little smaller. Both Eisen and PM are Taiwanese as origin and quality.

If you are looking at the Eisen 1236 take a look at the Precision Mathew PM1340GT. It is a high quality lathe and I can actually speak from personal experience on that particular lathe.
 
I own a G4003G and I'm happy with my purchase. I'm in the G4003 fan club and I have tricked mine out with a kick ass DroPro's EL400 DRO are you with me so far? Yes the 'gunsmith' version of this lathe gets some nice upgrades like the D1-5 cam lock vs the more puny cam lock on the G4003. Worth the added cost I say yes.

Now lets get to the flaws so you are not surprised if you purchase this lathe. This lathe is CHINA so go into it with your eyes open. That means CHINA QCTP and holders, CHINA paint job, CHINA assembly, and CHINA quality in some areas. In no particular order...

1. The stand is too tall unless you are 6'6" and too shallow, it will not inspire confidence in terms of tipping over, more so if you install leveling pads which makes it even shallower. I'd bolt it down if I were in an earth quake zone. I'm going to have to build a shorter more stable stand for mine.

2. The paint job was average, I had to finish painting the stands and the paint job on the lathe is sub-par in areas with flaking.

3. Assembly in some areas was poor, I had to re-drill and tap the motor mounts because the motor was positioned too far towards the tailstock to align the motor pulley with the spindle pulley. The factory just hung the motor pulley half off the motor shaft instead of fixing the problem.

4. The motor pulley was so horribly machined it wobbled on the motor shaft in cartoon like fashion. Grizzly sent me a replacement pulley that runs dead nuts true so problem solved but this does speak to quality of assembly and component quality.

5. The motor was installed so visibly crooked I question the QC inspection. In the picture below you can see that I have fixed the issues and mounted the motor square and parallel.

6. The head stock oil drain plug is located in a retarded position guaranteed to make draining the oil a mess.

7. The area where the bolts hold the gap in the ways down is a chip magnet, I fashioned a stainless sheet metal cover for that area to ease cleanup.

That about covers my annoyances with the lathe, it has performed well with no issues. I did spend some time eliminating vibration from the spindle due to the V belts. Mind you made in USA Napa V belts were no better than the factory V belts. I switched to linked belts for a nice improvement. So if you go this route just plan on having to address some quality and assembly issues. I feel for the money it was still a good value and have purchased enough CHINA machines to know what I would be getting into. I don't know anything about the PM lathe but took a look, I was hoping it had a lower RPM for threading but both lathes are 70 RPM's.

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