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Just Ordered Pm-727m, What Do I Need
- Thread starter kf4zht
- Start date
- Joined
- May 29, 2014
- Messages
- 188
I chipped the tip of a new one yesterday. Stupid on my part.
I had it installed in an ER-32 collet and when I released the nut, my finger wasn't quite touching it (my normal practice with drills & mills) to prevent them from dropping out. IT DID (drop)!!!--right on to the vise. Small chip on one flute. Unpure words followed--didn't do any good, chip was still there.
Stuff Happens, I guess.
Jerry in Delaware
I had it installed in an ER-32 collet and when I released the nut, my finger wasn't quite touching it (my normal practice with drills & mills) to prevent them from dropping out. IT DID (drop)!!!--right on to the vise. Small chip on one flute. Unpure words followed--didn't do any good, chip was still there.
Stuff Happens, I guess.
Jerry in Delaware
As an owner of the 727 myself, the most important thing I did was to add a DRO. I don't have the cash for a high dollar set up so I went with the Igaging scales. I have only installed them on the X and Y so far, as there is a quill mounted DRO included on the machine. So, for about $90, I have mine all set up. You will need to fab up some of the installation hardware, but that is what makes it so fun and rewarding when you start cranking those dials without having to count revolutions!!
I think you have a pretty good handle on the short term needs. Definitely get a set of parallels. You will need those pretty often, particularly when dealing with smaller parts. One thing I have found invaluable is a machinist square. They are pretty cheap and come in real handy when putting things in the vise that don't have square ends to sit on the ways of the vise.
As far as end mills, messing up a few is part of the learning curve. I started out with the full 20 piece HSS set that everybody sells. You can get them at Shars, Enco, Travers, Harbor Freight, etc. There are plenty of sellers on Ebay. I would get a set just to learn with. The best deal may be if you have a 20% off coupon at HF. You will find that you will use some sizes a lot, like 1/4, 3/8. and 1/2. You can buy a lot of individual end mills off Ebay as well. I am a big fan of cobalt end mills as they are inbetween the price points of cheap HSS and carbide, and they will stay sharp for a good while. Roughing end mills are your friend. They will allow you to make all of the nasty, hogging cuts with much less effort and strain on the machine, and at the same time allow you to avoid dulling those nice sharp finishing end mills. My personal favorites are the 3/8" and 1/2" M42 roughers that Shars sells individually on Ebay. The 3/8" is approx. $10 shipped and the 1/2" is about $13 shipped.
The one thing that you should keep a good supply of is cutting oil or some type of lube. I buy Oatey Dark Cutting Oil at Lowes hardware for $5. I probably go through a couple of those a month. If you ever mill without lube, your HSS and cobalt end mills will dull quickly.
The other thing is way oil for the ways and oil or grease for the lead screws. The one thing that I didn't like about my 727 is that the handwheels are fitted with ball oilers. I used oil for the first week or two. The problem is that the handwheel brackets are not sealed and the oil literally runs right out the bottom. I took mine apart and cleaned them well and then greased them up good with a Lithium based grease. No more worrying about creaking handwheels.
When you get ready to move the machine, put the head all the way down until the quill almost touches the table. I then put a block of wood under the bottom of the head housing and lifted it from there. The wood I uses was wide enough to spread the straps out and keep them off of the electrical connections running into the back of the electrical box.
If you use the metal base that comes with the machine, check it to be sure it is square and flat. I didn't pay attention to mine and it was off so much that the base of the mill was actually twisting and I was getting some lifting of the table at the travel limits. I was actually getting a slight bow in my cuts on large pieces until I figured that out. Also, I had to build a base for my stand that added 5 inches to the height. I am 5'11" and the factory height would have caused some serious back problems.
My next addition is going to be a rotary table with chuck and tail stock. Then of course I will have to get a coxial indicator to center the darned thing under the spindle...
And remember, pictures or it didn't happen!!
I think you have a pretty good handle on the short term needs. Definitely get a set of parallels. You will need those pretty often, particularly when dealing with smaller parts. One thing I have found invaluable is a machinist square. They are pretty cheap and come in real handy when putting things in the vise that don't have square ends to sit on the ways of the vise.
As far as end mills, messing up a few is part of the learning curve. I started out with the full 20 piece HSS set that everybody sells. You can get them at Shars, Enco, Travers, Harbor Freight, etc. There are plenty of sellers on Ebay. I would get a set just to learn with. The best deal may be if you have a 20% off coupon at HF. You will find that you will use some sizes a lot, like 1/4, 3/8. and 1/2. You can buy a lot of individual end mills off Ebay as well. I am a big fan of cobalt end mills as they are inbetween the price points of cheap HSS and carbide, and they will stay sharp for a good while. Roughing end mills are your friend. They will allow you to make all of the nasty, hogging cuts with much less effort and strain on the machine, and at the same time allow you to avoid dulling those nice sharp finishing end mills. My personal favorites are the 3/8" and 1/2" M42 roughers that Shars sells individually on Ebay. The 3/8" is approx. $10 shipped and the 1/2" is about $13 shipped.
The one thing that you should keep a good supply of is cutting oil or some type of lube. I buy Oatey Dark Cutting Oil at Lowes hardware for $5. I probably go through a couple of those a month. If you ever mill without lube, your HSS and cobalt end mills will dull quickly.
The other thing is way oil for the ways and oil or grease for the lead screws. The one thing that I didn't like about my 727 is that the handwheels are fitted with ball oilers. I used oil for the first week or two. The problem is that the handwheel brackets are not sealed and the oil literally runs right out the bottom. I took mine apart and cleaned them well and then greased them up good with a Lithium based grease. No more worrying about creaking handwheels.
When you get ready to move the machine, put the head all the way down until the quill almost touches the table. I then put a block of wood under the bottom of the head housing and lifted it from there. The wood I uses was wide enough to spread the straps out and keep them off of the electrical connections running into the back of the electrical box.
If you use the metal base that comes with the machine, check it to be sure it is square and flat. I didn't pay attention to mine and it was off so much that the base of the mill was actually twisting and I was getting some lifting of the table at the travel limits. I was actually getting a slight bow in my cuts on large pieces until I figured that out. Also, I had to build a base for my stand that added 5 inches to the height. I am 5'11" and the factory height would have caused some serious back problems.
My next addition is going to be a rotary table with chuck and tail stock. Then of course I will have to get a coxial indicator to center the darned thing under the spindle...
And remember, pictures or it didn't happen!!
Your thread was very helpful in deciding on the machine. I do plan on adding a DRO soon, probably start with the igauging and do the bluetooth adapter thing down the road. I'm a fair hand with a soldering iron so it should be pretty easy. For the time being I want to do some manual work so I know how to do it and can compare how much better it is. Thanks for the lifting advice. Last night I grabbed a lifting sling from HF so I didnt have to use a way too long recovery strap or chain
From Enco I ordered:
B&S Edge finder (double ended)
Basic Parallel set
123 Blocks
Mighty Mag base
Mitytoyo DTI (.030)
Indicator holder
The machine shipped yesterday, as of this morning it should be at the UPS terminal tomorrow. Chances are I will wait till Friday for pickup to work around the weather. Last night I cleaned up the area it will be going and reorganized the tool box. Still need to move the drill press and find somewhere for the press. Also need to weld up the hitch mounts on the engine hoist. Unfortunately we have people coming over this saturday so cleaning has to be done first.
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2014
- Messages
- 4,059
Yeah, life interferes. but a hobby shop is such a relaxation, once you get to it.
Bye the way, you'll love your new mill, and the personal service if you have a problem.
Looks like the mill showed up at the terminal this morning and my enco order should be here today. Last night it was finally dry enough to get the chumpcar and trailer into the backyard and free the truck up. I will bring the truck to work tomorrow and pick it up on my way home.
Still need to order more endmills. The cheap in me is hitting a wall on everything I look at, and its really the shipping. I don't mind paying $15-20 for an good end mill, but when you then want $5 to send something that will fit in a $2 usps bubble mailer.
Researched DRO options. Looks like the the touchdro is the best and cheap. I have 3camels price watches for igaging slides and going to see if anyone at work is selling an old tablet. I am curious on the Z DRO. Are people connecting them to the spindle (which has a DRO) or on the entire head? Priority is X and Y for now.
Still need to order more endmills. The cheap in me is hitting a wall on everything I look at, and its really the shipping. I don't mind paying $15-20 for an good end mill, but when you then want $5 to send something that will fit in a $2 usps bubble mailer.
Researched DRO options. Looks like the the touchdro is the best and cheap. I have 3camels price watches for igaging slides and going to see if anyone at work is selling an old tablet. I am curious on the Z DRO. Are people connecting them to the spindle (which has a DRO) or on the entire head? Priority is X and Y for now.
Brown Santa showed up with my Enco order, got new toys:
And I finished cleaning up the area where the mill will go. The drill press has been moved out and the shop press moved into the corner. The mill will sit somewhere around where the press is in the pictures. There is 20amp power and an air line plumbed in right there, so I should have everything I need.
I did a 360 of my metalworking area. Trying to decide if there will be enough room for the future lathe, I think cabinets are needed to move storage vertically
The tool box is an old blueprint cabinet out of an alabama courthouse. I still need to cut a couple drawer fronts so I can make double height drawers that blend in. For drills, mills, taps, tig supplies, etc the tons of short drawers make for great storage.
And I finished cleaning up the area where the mill will go. The drill press has been moved out and the shop press moved into the corner. The mill will sit somewhere around where the press is in the pictures. There is 20amp power and an air line plumbed in right there, so I should have everything I need.
I did a 360 of my metalworking area. Trying to decide if there will be enough room for the future lathe, I think cabinets are needed to move storage vertically
The tool box is an old blueprint cabinet out of an alabama courthouse. I still need to cut a couple drawer fronts so I can make double height drawers that blend in. For drills, mills, taps, tig supplies, etc the tons of short drawers make for great storage.
So the last couple days have been busy with the party and work.
Mill got picked up Friday, UPS did a great job, no damage and loaded it right up. I probably overstrapped it but better safe than sorry.
As a note if you pickup with a truck or trailer, PM puts tons of notices on the box basically making the carrier aware that they need to be very careful. Rip these off before you start driving, they are not on well enough for even 45mph. I had to pull over and rip them off.
That evening I got the base off, which is where they store the starter package if you order it. Looks like I will need to do some shimming on the base, my concrete is not that level.
To get it off the truck and through the door (32") I welded some 3 point attachments on my engine hoist. This will let me use it like a boom arm and not need the leg extensions.
This went quite well at first
And then it didn't...
It looks like one of the 2 bolts holding the boom to the base lost its nut. This let it torque to the side and the flat bar straps did nothing. When I pulled them off I was able to bend them back by hand. Went looking for a replacement bolt since I don't stock many metric nuts. 1/2 was too small and 5/8 would almost fit. Past experience drilling that chinese "steel" and in general using large bits in a hand drill led me to digging through the random hardware bin. In a stroke of luck the missing nut was the exact same threading as the lug nuts on my truck
No more pictures, at this point I was way behind. But I got it on the stand, the stand shimmed to the floor. I had missed the hardware bag in the stand and did a search everywhere to find it before discovering it wedged in the hinge of the door. Unlike a couple other people I read the bolt pattern was correct on my stand. I was a little annoyed the chip pan was nailed instead of screwed to the crate, it was annoying to get off without damage.
Ran it for a little while and was able to do some test cuts on aluminum. 1/4 end mill on full speed did .150 doc with no issues, I'm sure I can go more aggressive than that. Need to get it trammed in over this week. Some end mill should be showing up soon. Next on the list is a keyless chuck and start the DRO project. After than I am trying to decide between a Boring Head (and coax indicator) or fly cutter/face mill or rotary table.
A few things I found wrong and had/need to fix:
Collet locator screw in too far and preventing collets from snugging up tight - cleaned, loctited and set
Drawbar too long - added washers
No cable management for power cord, waiting on DRO wires
Gib adjusts on z are all in the handles way and the one for x are just annoying. Plan on shortening the z axis ones and replacing the x axis with socket cap screws
T-nuts were a little too wide. Sanded 2 of them down but plan on machining the others for a precise fit.
Mill got picked up Friday, UPS did a great job, no damage and loaded it right up. I probably overstrapped it but better safe than sorry.
As a note if you pickup with a truck or trailer, PM puts tons of notices on the box basically making the carrier aware that they need to be very careful. Rip these off before you start driving, they are not on well enough for even 45mph. I had to pull over and rip them off.
That evening I got the base off, which is where they store the starter package if you order it. Looks like I will need to do some shimming on the base, my concrete is not that level.
To get it off the truck and through the door (32") I welded some 3 point attachments on my engine hoist. This will let me use it like a boom arm and not need the leg extensions.
This went quite well at first
And then it didn't...
It looks like one of the 2 bolts holding the boom to the base lost its nut. This let it torque to the side and the flat bar straps did nothing. When I pulled them off I was able to bend them back by hand. Went looking for a replacement bolt since I don't stock many metric nuts. 1/2 was too small and 5/8 would almost fit. Past experience drilling that chinese "steel" and in general using large bits in a hand drill led me to digging through the random hardware bin. In a stroke of luck the missing nut was the exact same threading as the lug nuts on my truck
No more pictures, at this point I was way behind. But I got it on the stand, the stand shimmed to the floor. I had missed the hardware bag in the stand and did a search everywhere to find it before discovering it wedged in the hinge of the door. Unlike a couple other people I read the bolt pattern was correct on my stand. I was a little annoyed the chip pan was nailed instead of screwed to the crate, it was annoying to get off without damage.
Ran it for a little while and was able to do some test cuts on aluminum. 1/4 end mill on full speed did .150 doc with no issues, I'm sure I can go more aggressive than that. Need to get it trammed in over this week. Some end mill should be showing up soon. Next on the list is a keyless chuck and start the DRO project. After than I am trying to decide between a Boring Head (and coax indicator) or fly cutter/face mill or rotary table.
A few things I found wrong and had/need to fix:
Collet locator screw in too far and preventing collets from snugging up tight - cleaned, loctited and set
Drawbar too long - added washers
No cable management for power cord, waiting on DRO wires
Gib adjusts on z are all in the handles way and the one for x are just annoying. Plan on shortening the z axis ones and replacing the x axis with socket cap screws
T-nuts were a little too wide. Sanded 2 of them down but plan on machining the others for a precise fit.
P
pepi
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You said a mouth full, Atlanta is awful for machines & machine tools. Never have I seen so much rusty vintage junk.
I was talking with a seller of a PM 25 mill, tried to close the deal today.....guy forgot to tell me he sold it Sunday. Think that may turn out to be a good thing cause I spotted the PM 727M and that looks like a more robust mill. Funny how things work out sometimes...in the end I would have only save 500 and no warranty......