New Sieg Runmaster 330x1000 Lathe

[ronboult]

Hi
I currently own a Sieg SC4 chinese lathe and have been considering an upgrade for some time. I have outgrown the bolt on chuck/spindle assembly and the lack of a QCGB on the SC4. Otherwise the SC4 lathe performs very well.

My search of the lathe distributors in Australia turned up a limited range of new lathes in my price range and I finally settled on a Sieg Runmaster 330x1000 ( 13x40).
See http://www.ausee.com.au/shop/item.aspx?itemid=3419.

We don't have many (any?) specialty machine importers in Au like Precision Mathews and looking at the generic Chinese lathes available did not impress. Most of the Lathes in my price range were still imperial and I wanted metric. The Runmaster is much larger than what I wanted/needed but there was nothing with the features I wanted in between the SC4 and the Runmaster.

A Sieg SC10 (See http://www.ausee.com.au/shop/category.aspx?catid=6155) was considered but given the limited accessories with the SC10 ( No stand, no brake, 1 chuck and no steadies the Runmaster was a much better buy.

The Runmaster has some superior features like wider bed width etc and since I was familiar with the quality of Sieg machines (I own 2) I decided to go with the Runmaster.

Runmaster appears to originate in Taiwan but now manufactures in mainland China. What their association is with Sieg is unknown. Whether the lathe is manufactured by Sieg under licence or is just rebadged I can't determine.
Lathe was ordered 10 days ago and was delivered from Melbourne to a depot in Brisbane in 4days. Now sitting in depot for 5 days waiting for it to be delivered to the island where I live, hopefully in the next few days

Pictures of delivery & setup promised!

Ron

 

[ronboult]

Well my Sieg Runmaster lathe has finally arrived. After sitting in a freight depot on the mainland for over week it arrived on a delivery truck last Friday. The truck had a front mounted crane and with two sling under the pallet the lathe was offloaded and placed neatly on planks and rollers we had placed outside the entrance to my garage workshop. The truck driver then placed the crane boom behind the bottom of the pallet and with three mates guiding he gently pushed the crate and it rolled easily into to shop on the rollers underneath. The truck driver new exactly what he was doing and my lathe is now in the workshop without even a scratch. After removing the plywood box I checked for any damage and took some photos to post.



I have started the process of removing the rollers /planks& pallet and fitting the adjustable legs supplied. Then to removing all the sticky goo that Chinese manufacturers like to coat their machines with prior to shipping. Mineral turpentine seems to remove it fairly readily without harming the paint. I then have to fit a 3Phase lead and plug before I can do first tests. Final setup will have to await the arrival of a new BXA QCTP and a machinists level.

So far I am quite happy with the quality and condition of the lathe. Much as I expected based on my other two Sieg machines.
More pictures of setup and a review of the features and quality of this lathe to follow.
Ron

 

[wrmiller]

Nice. I like the layout of the apron controls, which are opposite of mine. Would work great for a lefty like me.

 

[ronboult]

Hi Bill
Thanks for the comments

So far I am very pleased with the general fit finish and quality of the Runmaster. I bought it sight unseen going only on my experience of my Sieg SC4.
I think Sieg make aprons with both right or left layout. My Sieg SC4 has the opposite orientation i.e. Hand wheel on the left. I am right handed and don't know which is best. From my first trials the hand wheel falls naturally to my right hand and is out of the line of fire from hot chips. Time will tell which I like best. Anyway this is the one they import into Au so I had no choice.

Waiting for a QCTP so I can make my first chips.

In the meantime cleaning, oiling and setting as close to level as I can make it. Love the D14 Camlock, such an improvement over the bolt on chuck on my SC4. Also the QCGB, how did I survive without one. Oh well I didn't know any better when I bought my first lathe. Do you know if they import the larger Sieg Runmasters into the USA?
Ron

 

[darkzero]

Nice looking lathe Ron, good to see you finally got it. I don't think they import these to the US unless someone very recently started too. When I was lathe shopping in 2008 I never came across one & I'm pretty sure I would have during my countless searches. The first time I ever heard of Sieg having lathes this large it is when you mentioned it to me & gave me the link. I always thought Sieg just made mini machines.

I used to think lathes with the apron handwheel on the right were left hand lathes. But I don't think that's true. I guess a tru left hand lathe would have the headstock on the right side which I have seen but still I don't think those are actually left hand lathes, just some sort of specialty lathe?

Like the tool post T-nut that seems to be a US thing & the type you have to be European, it seems like lathes with the apron handwheel on the left is also a US thing. Most lathes for the European & Asian markets have the apron handwheel on the right side. But I have used some large old American lathes with the apron handwheel on the right. To my understanding the reason for having the apron handwheel on the right side is for gap lathes, so it doesn't run out of rack engagement when feeding the carriage close to the spindle.

 

[ronboult]

Finally removed the rollers and planks and installed the adjustable leg screws and pucks. Then the cleanup of all the protective goo. Mineral Turpentine did a good job.


When I removed the supplied Toolpost to fit a new BXA Phase II QCTP I discovered that the post had a boss at the base that won't allow the Phase II to fit.



Had to press the post out ( it was a press fit with a roll pin to stop it rotating). I think this type of post is European rather than the T slot common on USA supplied lathes.
Anyway I still have my little Sieg SC4 which was pressed into service to make the new post. Started with a 40mm x 140mm piece of 12L14 and removed most of it. My poor little SC4 has never removed so much metal in all its life. Actually turned out quite well. Even on my small lathe carbide inserts work very well for this purpose. Thread was single pointed as I don't have a 16mm die. Biggest problem was that the bore of the Phase II QCTP was quite rough and smaller at the base than the top. Great Chinese quality control.



I was hoping for a Dorian BXA but there are too much other tooling to buy so the Dorian will have to wait. I actually bought the Phase II because others had suggested that it was slightly better quality than other Chinese imports. If so the others must be horrible.

QCTP finally fitted with a suitable shim to ensure that the top locking handle locks up in the correct position.

And finally first chips.


The lathe has only been roughly levelled with a carpenters level( I have ordered an Engineers Level) but so far I am impressed. First thing to remove is the stupid chuck guard. You can't see a thing with it in place. Much more dangerous with than without.

Problems so far have been few. The Toolpost mount was unexpected and the Tailstock has a 4mm pitch leadscrew but the verier scale only has 2.45mm graduations per revolution. Looks like the factory installed a Compound leadscrew vernier on the Tailstock by mistake. The Supplier has been great and has ordered a new scale. It is easily replaced.

I ordered the Lathe with a DRO installed. It has Sinpo scales but some nondiscript generic Readout Head. The Chinglish Instruction manual is no help and it took me along time to figure out how to change the X axis to read diameter rather than radius removal.

After removal and cleaning of the 3 jaw I found that fitting the D14 in each of the three positions produced no change in run out which is great. However swapping the three jaws into the various positions produced considerable changes with only one position producing a minimum of 0.03mm. This was not the position in which they were supplied. Interestingly using ground rods of different sizes the runout seems remarkably constant at least in the first 25 mm where I could measure. The chuck is a generic Chinese version of unknown parentage so not too bad. I will probably replace it with something better when funds permit. Haven't looked at the 4J independent yet. Will report what I find.

Fortunately My sieg SC4 uses 12mm tooling in the OXA post so I am OK in the short term but the BXA probably deserves 16mm in the future.

Biggest problem is the Head stock and Tailstock tapers ( TS 4 MT & HS 5MT with 5 to 4 sleeve). None of my other tooling from the SC4 fits. May be some sleeves in first instance but I am tempted to just bite the bullet and upgrade properly.
Beside buying new tooling is FUN!!!!!!!!

Ron

Just Checked and the DRO Readout is a DELOS
The Chucks are HUA-PAI
Anybody know anything regarding these brands?