Trials and tribulations of insert decoding

I bought a HHIP 1/2" cutoff tool, even in the lowest height on the AXA holder, I had to mill off about 1mm just to get right at the center of the work. I have a Grizzly g0602z 10x22 lathe. I lean towards trying an XL AXA holder and jst seeing what works and what mods I need to make. All my other 3/8' tools, there are plenty of options, but I am limited on this WCMT. Maybe it's good enough, but since I'm still in the early stages, I'd rather build my inventory with what works for now and in the future rather then spending tons on 3/8' when I end up at 1/2" or even 5/8".
I'm buying an XL now and both a 1/2" and 5/8" unless there are any other thoughts...
 
The holders you purchased may but that is not the original Aloris standard. Aloris standard is 1/2" for AXA, 5/8" for oversize. 5/8" is standard for BXA & 3/4" for oversized.

Newer Dorian holders jump up 2 sizes for their oversized holders, 3/4" for AXA & 1" for BXA. But just because you can fit the larger tools in one of these extreme oversized tool holders doesn't mean they will work with your lathe.
That's my concern. I guess there is only one way to find out for sure? I don't know if my HHIP cut off just isn't design on the low side, rather the high. Perhaps other tools will be better or worse.
 
That's my concern. I guess there is only one way to find out for sure? I don't know if my HHIP cut off just isn't design on the low side, rather the high. Perhaps other tools will be better or worse.

Generally, with indexable tools the cutter height is inline with the top of the shank. But this doesn't apply to all tools like boring bars for example. To find out you will need to measure the distance from the top of your compound slide (surface the tool post sits on) to spindle centerline. You'll need at least 15/16" height to run 1/2" tools in AXA. If you don't have at least 15/16" than an AXA tool post is technically too big for your lathe. In that case you would have to mill material off the bottom of the tool holders, mill off the bottom of the tool shank, or run smaller shank tools.
 
I believe AXA is correct for my 10x20 Griz G0602z...but I agree, that doesn't mean all 1/2" or 5/8" will work. I just placed an order for a 5/8" AXA hold and a 3 piece tool/cutter set (one tool is a WNMG) We will see where this goes and what I have to modify. I appreciate the complound to spindle measurement, I will check that now. I'll get it to work, but depending on how much modifying it takes, perhaps I will try 1/2" next. Nothing risked, nothing gained I guess, I just can't deal with that one tool having zero options on inserts. I'll keep anyone interested posted.
Thanks much guys!
 
My son just bought an Accusize mill cutter and I see what you mean about the cutters. Seems like Accusize has bastardized all the standard nomenclature and come up with their own rendition to keep you buying their inserts. These are APKT11T3.Have no clue as to what the KT11T3 are supposed to translate to.
 
Yeah, there are the ones they go by their own standards of jibberish, but I will say with time it gets a bit more easier to understand. I know this opens doors for “debate” but as usual, the metric side of things is a bit more sensical.
 
There are an absolute ton of different insert geometries. I'd categorize them as standard and proprietary. The standard inserts are available everywhere and are easy to find matching holders. Every manufacturer also has proprietary inserts. These are usually custom made to fit a specific tool or family of tools. Often they are targeted at a higher performance market who is willing to buy into the family of tools and supporting hardware.

I'd recommend sticking to the common shapes and sizes. Here is an example list which is far from inclusive.
  • CNMG (Most common insert, general purpose, negative rake, high cutting forces, my 12x36 can barely handle these, CNMG432 is most common)
  • CCMT (Positive rake general purpose insert, my go-to, CCMT32.50 is my favorite)
  • TCMT (Triangle insert, often used on boring bars)
  • DCMT (medium diamond insert, weaker than CCMT, stronger than VCMT. DCMT21.51 fits some of my boring bars)
  • VCMT (sharp diamond insert, weak, but low cutting forces and excellent accessibility, ideal for fine finishing, VCMT110304 is my go to)
  • SCMT (square insert, used for heavy turning or chamfers)
There are metric and imperial designations. For example CCMT31.51 and CCMT090304 are the same insert. The first is the imperial designation (used by Shars for example) and the second is the metric designation you'll see on AliExpress.

Next are different edge conditions and rake angles. xxMT is common for general purpose positive rake inserts (e.g. CCMT32.50). xxGX or xxGT are uncoated, high polish, sharp ground edge inserts great for plastic or non-ferrous metals (e.g. CCGT090304).

Finally, the corner radius is very important. In the imperial designation, the "31.5" is the insert size while the "0" is the corner radius (e.g. CCMT32.50 vs CCMT 32.52). "0" is a near sharp corner, "1" is a medium radius, and "2" is a heavy radius (manufacturers will provide the exact dimension. In the metric designation, the last 2 digits (e.g. "04" in CCMT090304) are the corner radius. "02" is near sharp, "04" is medium, and "08" is heavy. A heavy radius creates a stronger tool for roughing and ideally a better surface finish at high feed cutting, but tremendously higher cutting forces. A sharp edge will deflect the workpiece less, giving more accurate dimensions. The corner radius also determines the minimum depth of cut you can take. I strongly recommend the near sharp corner for machines under a 12" swing. I rarely use the medium corner inserts and only for roughing.

The included angle of the insert also determines cutting forces. The lower the cutting forces, the more accurate your dimensions will be after the cut. That is why the VCMT (30 degree included angle) will finish more accurately than the CCMT (80 degree included angle) in most cases.

The xxGT edge condition also drastically reduces cutting forces, but is a weak edge. They are ideal for soft materials (and have excellent life), but also give good performance in alloy steel and especially stainless, although they have a much reduced insert life.
 
The inscribed circle is based very loosely on old imperial value.
 
@macardoso I have recently using WNMG432 in my 12X37, and have been having good results. They give 6 corners per insert, but are at the very top end of what the 1 1/2 HP motor can push.
 
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