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3/4-16 Sherline spindle adapter to ER16

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Howard_S

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I have a Sherline mill with a 3/4-16 spindle thread. The MT1 collets are very limited and have a small range, also I am spending a lot of time pulling out the draw bar, generally a pain in the neck. I am thinking of going to ER16 collets. My choices are somewhat limited, I can get a new headstock from Sherline with a ER16 spindle for $200.00. a good solution but my existing tools, like fly cutter, Jacobs chuck etc are now useless. The other choice is an adapter from 3/4-16 to ER16. Beal makes one for about $60.00 and Taig makes one for about $30.00.
Does anyone have any experience with these solutions? What are the restrictions, TIR, issues?
Howard
 

David S

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I am not a user, but I would think and advantage would be that longer things could be passed through the collet into the spindle without a draw bar, assuming other things are ok.

David
 

mikey

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Hey Howard,
I am not aware of a Beall ER-16 adapter. Can you post a link to it?

I went through this collet option thing, too, and decided that an ER-20 system would have been ideal for me but nobody makes one for the Sherline mill. Accuracy matters for a milling machine tool holder and until Beall came out with their ER-32 chuck, there was just nothing on the market that would work. I ended up going with the Beall ER-32 chuck and it has worked out quite well. Mine has about 0.0001" TIR, which is about as accurate as my spindle.

I use a Rego-Fix nut on my ER-32 chuck. With a Techniks 6mm collet, I measure under 0.0002" TIR when using a Keo Woodruff keyseat cutter. If you have cut keyseats before then you know how critical run out is and the Beall chuck worked fine.

I also use the Beall chuck on my lathe so that is a big plus.

My suggestion to you is to go with the Beall ER-32 chuck. There is nothing on the market made to fit a Sherline spindle that is as accurate, at least to my knowledge. You will lose some height in Z because of it, though. I went to a 15" column and use a column riser so I have plenty of room. I think I have about 14" of space above the vise, which is more than most mini-mills.
 

Howard_S

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Hey Howard,
I am not aware of a Beall ER-16 adapter. Can you post a link to it?

I went through this collet option thing, too, and decided that an ER-20 system would have been ideal for me but nobody makes one for the Sherline mill. Accuracy matters for a milling machine tool holder and until Beall came out with their ER-32 chuck, there was just nothing on the market that would work. I ended up going with the Beall ER-32 chuck and it has worked out quite well. Mine has about 0.0001" TIR, which is about as accurate as my spindle.

I use a Rego-Fix nut on my ER-32 chuck. With a Techniks 6mm collet, I measure under 0.0002" TIR when using a Keo Woodruff keyseat cutter. If you have cut keyseats before then you know how critical run out is and the Beall chuck worked fine.

I also use the Beall chuck on my lathe so that is a big plus.

My suggestion to you is to go with the Beall ER-32 chuck. There is nothing on the market made to fit a Sherline spindle that is as accurate, at least to my knowledge. You will lose some height in Z because of it, though. I went to a 15" column and use a column riser so I have plenty of room. I think I have about 14" of space above the vise, which is more than most mini-mills.
Mikey
Wow I almost made a big mistake, thanks for catching it, your right Beal makes an ER32 chuck and a 50. Good to hear the TIR is so low. How do you handle 1/32 and smaller drills? A Jacobs chuck? I also have a 15 inch column and the ER32 is only 1/2 inch longer than the ER16 so I guess that's not really a problem. Looks like I will go with the Beal chuck. Did you buy Beal collets or all from Techniks?
Thanks
Howard
 

mikey

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I use a Rohm keyless chuck for drills. It is actually faster to switch to the drill chuck when drilling, at least for me, and also much faster to switch from a spotter to a drill to a chamfering tool in a drill chuck.

The Beall chuck I bought came with 5 ER-32 collets. Chinese, of course, but pretty accurate. I use these for work holding on the lathe only. For tool holding on the mill, I use Techniks collets only. My accuracy, finish and tool life is better with the better collets so that's what I choose to do. In my opinion, it is false economy to use cheap collets for tool holding on the mill. Over time, you eat up whatever savings you might have had from tool wear alone and you continue to lose money as long as you use those cheap collets. My suggestion is to buy a set of Techniks collets and be done with it and only use them for tool holding. I use the Imperial version because I mostly use Imperial sized tools. For the occasional metric tool, I buy a Techniks collet to specifically fit it.

You are going to notice a big difference in how your end mills cut when you switch from an end mill holder to an ER chuck. Good decision on your part, I think.

Sherline uses the face of the spindle register for accuracy. That is the vertical face right behind the threads. Be sure your register is clean and free of burrs because this has a lot to do with how accurate any chuck will be. When you get your chuck, check it for concentricity with a good dti. If you aren't sure how to do that, PM me.

Beall is very good to work with if anything goes wrong - really, really good company.
 

Forty Niner

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I have a Sherline mill with a 3/4-16 spindle thread. The MT1 collets are very limited and have a small range, also I am spending a lot of time pulling out the draw bar, generally a pain in the neck. I am thinking of going to ER16 collets. My choices are somewhat limited, I can get a new headstock from Sherline with a ER16 spindle for $200.00. a good solution but my existing tools, like fly cutter, Jacobs chuck etc are now useless. The other choice is an adapter from 3/4-16 to ER16. Beal makes one for about $60.00 and Taig makes one for about $30.00.
Does anyone have any experience with these solutions? What are the restrictions, TIR, issues?
Howard
I bought the ER16 collet holder for my Taig lathe. I also bought a cheap set of ER-16 collets. They have worked ok on the Taig lathe.
As I was reading your post, I wondered if the setup would fit my Sherline mill, so I tried it Here it is with a 3/8 edge finder. Looks like it would work OK to me. Now I have another option! Runnout measured was 0.0002" with a tenth's indicator.286586
 
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mikey

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Looks that way to me, too.
 

Howard_S

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I bought the ER16 collet holder for my Taig lathe. I also bought a cheap set of ER-16 collets. They have worked ok on the Taig lathe.
As I was reading your post, I wondered if the setup would fit my Sherline mill, so I tried it Here it is with a 3/8 edge finder. Looks like it would work OK to me. Now I have another option! Runnout measured was 0.0002" with a tenth's indicator.View attachment 286586
This looks like a good option to try, thanks for the information. I did call Taig earlier today and they said it should work on the Sherline as long as the threads to the shoulder are less than 1/2 inch and it is, but thanks for confirming that input. By the way did you make the stand for the DRO or buy it, looks great.
Howard
 

Forty Niner

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The DRO for my Sherline is mounted on a leg that used to hold a plasma TV years ago. The TV is long gone, but the stands were perfect for holding the DRO's for my lathe and mill. Here is a better picture of the stand.
 

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Howard_S

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The DRO for my Sherline is mounted on a leg that used to hold a plasma TV years ago. The TV is long gone, but the stands were perfect for holding the DRO's for my lathe and mill. Here is a better picture of the stand.
Stand looks great.
I think I am going to get the Taig ER16 adapter with a few cheap collets and see how I like the ER system. If the adapter I get has a TIR less than .001 and I like the collet system I will stick with it. If the TIR is not where I want it I will get an ER16 headstock from Sherline and probably a few good collets from Technik. Thanks for all your help.
Howard
 

Howard_S

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After a lot of thought I ordered a Beal ER32 adapter and a Taig ER16 adapter both for the 3/4-16 Sherline mill spindle. I also ordered 3/8 inch Collets from Techniks for both adapters. I will get the parts in about 5 days and will update on the TIR and milling with 3/8 tool for both adapters. My reasoning was that additional tools like boring head and fly cutter are readily available on the ER32 but very limited on the ER16 size. So getting a new ER16 headstock while more accurate will be very limiting as far as additional tools go. The 3/4-16 headstock has a TIR of .0002 and the adapters are typically .0007 also pretty good.The Jacobs chucks for drilling are consistently .0025 with adapter, which is also typical for any chuck. The MT1 and Jacobs chuck has a TIR of .002 so hardly worth the effort of using the MT1 and drawbolt. So for non critical drilling I can use the 3/4-16 Jacobs adapter and chuck, very quick to go from spotting to drilling, and for the few times that accuracy matters I can use the ER-16 if its TIR is under .001and if not possibly the ER32. Milling on the ER32 is probably much better but I will try both.
I will post results in about a week.
 

mikey

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It will be interesting to see which is more accurate. One of the benefits of an ER chuck is that it dampens vibration well. The greater mass of the Beall chuck should work in its favor but we'll see.

I ordered an ER-20 chuck from Tormach for my RF-31 to run a similar experiment. We shall see.
 

Howard_S

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It will be interesting to see which is more accurate. One of the benefits of an ER chuck is that it dampens vibration well. The greater mass of the Beall chuck should work in its favor but we'll see.

I ordered an ER-20 chuck from Tormach for my RF-31 to run a similar experiment. We shall see.
I agree the chatter that is prevalent on these mini mills should be dramatically reduced. Looking forward to results.
 

Forty Niner

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Very Interesting Howard. I will be watching for your evaluation/experience.
 

Howard_S

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Very Interesting Howard. I will be watching for your evaluation/experience.
Keep in mind that my total experience is 6 months so I will make lots of mistakes but I will do my best and please offer advice if I am going down the wrong trail.
 

Howard_S

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Very Interesting Howard. I will be watching for your evaluation/experience.
I just received the ER16 adapter and collets and what a pleasant surprise!
Here is the data;
Sherline 3/4-16 spindle TIR=.0002
Spindle + Adapter TIR=.0006
Spindle + Adapter + ER16 collet + 3/8 Mill TIR=.0008
I will try to put up two videos, have not done that yet so it may not work.
I am supposed to get the Beal adapter tomorrow night.
 

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