Any Brazing Pros here?

ddickey

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I bought an oxy acetylene setup a year or so ago and the gentleman threw in a bunch of brazing rods. Unfortunately they were all mixed up in a few tubes. The only one I'm certain of is the flux coated nickel silver. The other i'm almost certain are the rods on the left, they are I believe low fume bronze. The other tube was labeled flux coated bronze so those are not in the pic. All the other I do not know what they are. I would be guessing the silver colored are silver brazing rods in different sizes. Any guesses?
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I bought an oxy acetylene setup a year or so ago and the gentleman threw in a bunch of brazing rods. Unfortunately they were all mixed up in a few tubes.
I brazed every day at work for over 20 years (retired now) but I never learned how to tell fillers apart by looking at them. Not labeling them is inept.

Silver is expensive, obviously more expensive as the silver content goes up. All the higher-silver filler I've used (40% to 56%) came in a coil packaged in a squat cylinder shaped plastic bin a bit bigger than a hockey puck. We kept it sealed up when not in use, only took off a piece as long as you were going to use that day, because it tarnishes (oxidizes) in air. Given the high cost, it would be a bit idiotic to leave them out loose getting dirty and tarnished. So, assuming the guy wasn't an idiot, I'm guessing those rods aren't silver. Or if they are, they're low silver content.

As I'm sure you know, silver requires flux made for silver. It melts and becomes active at a temperature just a bit lower than where the silver should begin to flow. So that could be a test for whether it's silver or not. If you have to get the steel glowing red for it to flow, then it's not like any silver I've ever used.

Bronze/brass does corrode in air too, but the flux is stronger, more cleaning power to lift oxides, so we aren't as fanatical about cleanliness, but for critical applications it's still worthwhile to scrub it with steel wool or scotchbrite before use, followed by a quick solvent wipe. Obviously not with flux-coated. We mostly went through it fast enough that it was still bright when we used it, but I would clean any old-looking rod before use. Don't make the flux work any harder than it needs to, it has a finite amount of cleaning power so don't use it up.

Nickel-silver (which contains no silver) is silver in color but behaves more like bronze. The liquidus is slightly higher than bronze, but you can use the same flux as made for bronze brazing. It's really strong, like stronger than a lot of steels, but doesn't flow as well as bronze so not as good for joints that need penetration by capillary action (commonly called "sweating"). One example is brazing cracked cast iron — use regular bronze for that, you need the capillary flow.

Some fillers are made for specialized applications, like metals other than steel. I've only brazed steel and only with a few types of filler, so I can't guess what those other rods are. Maybe try them and see how they work, but not for anything structural unless you're willing to do a lot of destructive testing. That can be as simple as breaking some sample joints with a vise with a cheater bar, no calibration other than your subjective feel for how hard it is to break. After you break enough samples you get a feel for how strong they should be.

Personally I have no use for filler of unknown composition, I'd only use them for non-brazing tasks like bending into hangers for things that will be painted or powdercoated
 
If they are copper coated with steel core , most likely they are welding rods and not brazing rods. The rods on the far right look like standard brass brazing rods to be used with flux. Only a guess.
 
The ones on the right came in a Harris tube labeled low fuming bronze. Also in that tube were the silver ones second from the left.
I'll have to do some experimentation.
 
Put a magnet on the copper-looking rods to determine if they are copper plated steel.
 
In order from left to right.
Not magnetic
slightly magnetic
All others until the last are strongly magnetic.
 
The ones on all the way on the right look like brass. Obviously, they are not, since they are strongly magnetic. A propane torch will melt silver brazing alloy easily and silicon or low fuming bronze with difficulty. Steel filler will not melt in a propane torch flame, but it may get almost white hot.
 
All the way on the right is not magnetic. So you think that's brass not low fume bronze?
 
All the way on the right is not magnetic. So you think that's brass not low fume bronze?
I'm one of those who stubbornly refer to the brazing filler as brass, though I'm well aware the welding industry calls the same stuff bronze.
I know I'm not alone in this, lots of people call it brass brazing.

I don't know about anyone else but I have two reasons:
1. The people who taught me, and most of the people I talked to within my industry, called it brass.
2. It matches the dictionary definition of brass, namely an alloy of principally copper and zinc. Bronze is principally copper and tin. All the brazing filler I used had loads of zinc and little to no tin. So why is it called bronze by the welding industry? No one seems to know.

Anyway I've been calling it brass for over 50 years now so I am unlikely to change. I like to think I have an open mind, so see if you can convince me. But I suspect my mind is not as open as I'd like to believe.

But I don't mind when other people call it bronze. I know they mean brass!
 
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