CNC - Milltronics, bridgeport, or tormach

[JackBrush]

I'm a firearms manufacturer but I've only dealt with 3d prints and parts kits. Trying to get a mill to first cut some lead molds and eventually hardened steel.
I've got a bead on a couple different secondhand machines around my area

1. Milltronics Partner IV CNC running camsoft, little info on the controller. Specifically mentioned DXF files which
Vertical knee mill
Looks a bit rough and in don't see a coolant system on it.
I don't know anything about this brand.
The guys a machinist so I imagine he'll remember more if he wants to sell it $6000.

2. Bridgeport v2xt
Vertical knee mill dated maybe around 2010
Im not sure what software its running specifically seems like the program reads BOSS dx32 2.38/4.54. I am not sure why there are 2 versions that or that's not a version number but some sort of metric. I got that its probably boss but I want to get a date on the software version.
Looks in great shape, everyone knows bridgeport. Aftermarket is active but if I buy it and then immediately have to retrofit the controller im gonna kick my neighbors truck where he usually kicks it after yelling at his wife.
$9000

Tormach
There's a couple tormachs around me but the dudes want ridiculous prices and I'd be better off buying new at that point except I'd have to get an 1100 and I m not thrilled about paying $25k to cut hard steel but if course there's a progression I could do instead of outright getting a usable machine.

Something I hadn't thought about was auto tool changing. Id imagine the bridgeport and milltronics wouldn't support that. I'm also eying to familiarize myself with these older software's as Im spoiled by 3d printing gcode slices.

I also saw some stuff about the speed of the knee mill cnc's being kind of slow which I imagine something like a tormach will always be faster because its not slinging a large 48" 200lb bed

 

[GT-6 Racer]

Have a look at the Trak bed mill. I love mine. It’s a dpms3. 40 taper Easy to use conversational programming or full 3D CNC from fusion.
Something like this

https://www.machinio.com/listings/91046131-2004-southwest-ind-dpm-s3-in-harrison-nj

stay away from the age controllers. SMX or newer. It’s not a vmc speed by any means but I think it’s very good as a tool room type mill. Run manually, power feed, CNC.

Very similar to the milltronics, which is also a good machine, but again be very careful with old controllers. I prefer the bedmill to the knee mill if doing heavy work.

haas makes a tool room open mill as well. Haas controllers older than 2008 are not supported anymore.

good luck with the search.

 

[Chipper5783]

I have a DX32 machine. It is a 1998 Bridgeport VMC1000 - the machine is different from what you are looking at, but the controller language is very, very similar to that one you are looking at (mine is not BOSS). In my experience DX32 works well (I have no significant experience with other controllers), it is very capable. I do not use any CAD/CAM, I enter the G code directly at the terminal (or on any computer with a text editor). Fusion 360 lists a post processor for DX32, I tried it once, but the file ballooned out too large to load into the machine’s memory (I didn’t bother figuring out how to drip feed).

Direct G code programming allows you to use the provided more sophisticated G codes - the resulting files are really not very big. I had zero prior CNC experience (lots of manual experience), I have been through the programming manual a lot, I’ve made a lot of parts and am getting very comfortable coding directly. For me I use it much like a manual machine, I send a line of code telling the machine what I want (once the program is sorted then the chips really fly). It was painfully slow at first, but it goes good now. So the DX32 can work, but you probably cannot get any sort of 3rd party support - you’ll be on your own. I am getting good results with the approach I am taking (learning to code), so I’m not really motivated to change anything (have moved on to sorting out a CNC lathe).

For a while I used G code wizard (Bob at CNC Cookbook), it was a good enough editor, but the error checking was not compatible with DX32. I quit using it.

I don’t know what it would take to upgrade the machine controller - my understanding from the various chat rooms is that it is a major undertaking (still have a machine with old hardware), as a minimum it is expensive - especially if you don’t have the computer /electronic skills.

My guess is that for most any old industrial CNC you will be largely on your own. Sure I’ve run into problems and breakdowns along the way, so far I’ve been able to sort them out.

 

[JackBrush]

I have a DX32 machine. It is a 1998 Bridgeport VMC1000 - the machine is different from what you are looking at, but the controller language is very, very similar to that one you are looking at (mine is not BOSS). In my experience DX32 works well (I have no significant experience with other controllers), it is very capable. I do not use any CAD/CAM, I enter the G code directly at the terminal (or on any computer with a text editor). Fusion 360 lists a post processor for DX32, I tried it once, but the file ballooned out too large to load into the machine’s memory (I didn’t bother figuring out how to drip feed).

That's pretty interesting, although I think you might have scaling issues if you weren't letting the thing automate

Have a look at the Trak bed mill. I love mine. It’s a dpms3. 40 taper Easy to use conversational programming or full 3D CNC from fusion.
Something like this

Damn, yeah this is what my goal is. Guess I'm still looking around.

 

[Karl_T]

I happen to be expert on Camsoft. The quality of the control refit work is everything here. Quick test, ask for software level and version number. Anything less than CNC Pro V 18.x I would not look farther. If it meets this find out exact servos on each axis and spindle. Ask who did the refit, one by a certified refitter is FAR batter than a home hack. Be sure and observe it run. Look inside the cabinets, is the electrical work done professionally? Did the refitter keep a print or record of what was done?

This one could be a real gem or a POS.

I'd be leary of that old bridgeport control. machine is overdue for a control refit.

IMHO, Tormach is for hobby use. just too light weight for manufacture of steel parts.

All this said, if you got the bucks I'd be looking at prototrak or even HAAS. But this is a whole different price point.

 

[JackBrush]

IMHO, Tormach is for hobby use. just too light weight for manufacture of steel parts.

All this said, if you got the bucks I'd be looking at prototrak or even HAAS. But this is a whole different price point.

Im pursuing this with the possibility of converting to a business but Im trying not too be deluded like some of the other guys here. Wanted to screw around with some machines first to see if I even wanted to do this which is why the 1/4 -1/2 ton were more attractive. Figured id start with aluminum. Wasn't planning on machining receivers in the next couple of months.

Im also planning a large national move from TX to MT so lighter would be easier on that. Seems like the used market round 'tana is pretty abysmal vs down here though. So i suppose its this or driving to Spokane sporadically for the next couple of years.

anyway ill do some more digging on camsoft and talk to the seller about what you recommended. Thankfully this guy is 30 minutes from me. The Bridgeport is 5 hours away.

 

[JackBrush]

heres a couple more photos from that post

i have no clue what the blue bracket is. maybe attaches to the spindle or something

 

[Chipper5783]

The blue bracket is for to hold the tools for tightening them (ie. the collet nut). Bolt it down to a work bench.

 

[Karl_T]

IMHO, CNC lite and Plus is cripple ware. Features you end up needing are disabled. The company goal here is to sell cheap to get you started, then have you pay more to upgrade to CNC Pro.

 

[PNW_Guy]

I wouldn't ever consider a Tormach for any material harder than aluminum. They have stepper motors rather than servo motors (to save cost) and they can (and frequently do) skip steps without realizing it. Feeding too fast? Scrap the part. For $25k, ouch.

Somebody else mentioned Trak/Southwest Industries. I'm a big fan of theirs. They sell a Bridgeport clone knee mill with ball screws and a CNC controller. You can use it as a manual mill, a conversational CNC machine or load a program and make parts. One of my favorite features is using the handwheels to control the speed of the GCode as it executes - forward or back.
You can get them with R8 or CAT spindles. The bed mill is bigger, but the price goes up.

The company uses import castings, but everything else is made and assembled near Los Angeles. The controller is awesome, especially for a new CNC user. Be careful, as the cheaper models only have 2D CNC (no power on Z)