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Dayton 6Y945 2x42 belt sander mods for HSS tool grinding..

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TerryH

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#1
After falling down the mini lathe rabbit hole I discovered yet another one when the enablers on this site ganged up on me. After being amazed by how well the tool worked that @ttabbal ground and sent to me I set out to be able to grind my own. Then came a 1000 PM's back and forth with @mikey on what I needed for a sander and exactly how to go about the actual grinding. Once I got @mikey 's models from @Z2V I wanted to get a grinder set up correctly ASAP. So thanks to @mikey , @ttabbal and @Z2V for throwing me over this cliff.

I'm a total machining newbie. Definitely just a hobby for me but I like to have the right tools for whatever I'm doing. I simply could not justify spending $500+ on a nice sander nor did I want to invest the time to build one from scratch so I started researching one that I could afford. Enter the Dayton 6Y945 2x42/disc sander. It's available from multiple suppliers but I opted to get mine at Grainger. They had a good price ($149.50) and my local store is 2 minutes from my work.

Dayton 6Y945 @ Grainger



The modifications that will be made are to make a solid platen base and add a 01 tool steel platen backer and a Pyroceram platen per @mikey 's mods to his sander. I'm also making a new table from 1/4 steel plate including a more stable mounting and more repeatable adjust-ability.

Link to that article..

http://www.machinistblog.com/modifying-a-craftsman-2-x-42-inch-belt-sander-for-tool-grinding/

I sourced the backer and the plate on Ebay. Here are those links.

$21.18 shipped. 01 tool steel backer...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/O1-Tool-St...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

$21.00 shipped. Pyroceram platen...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Glass-plat...m=163066307996&_trksid=p2047675.c100011.m1850

Here's the backer and the platen.



The glass will be attached to the backer with JB Weld. For added safety I drilled and tapped for 2 10-24 cap screws for the platen to rest on.





The original platen flexes and that is not what we need for this application. The new one is made from 2x3x.125 rectangular tubing. Definitely not going to flex.

I drilled holes to match the original to mount it to the sander and to mount the platen backer. The backer was drilled and tapped for 2 1/4-20 cap screws. I drilled oversize holes in the back and side to access those cap screws. I also radiused the bottom edge to clear the upcoming new table mounts.

New vs original.



And with the platen backer mounted.





Once that assembly is complete I attached the platen to the backer. Regular JB Weld and some light clamping pressure do the job. I sanded the back of the platen with 80 grit paper to give it some tooth.



While the glue up cures, I need to solve an interesting problem with the sander. My best guess is that the folks at Dayton were determined to not allow super coarse paper to be used on the machine as it's only 1/3 hp. Per @mikey 's suggestion, I have 40 grit ceramic paper and it literally will not fit between the drive wheel and the housing. I had to cut the lower portion of the housing off to allow clearance for the belt.





The new table will be mounted on a piece of 10mm all thread vs just the single bolt as it has brackets on both sides instead of just one side like the original so I went ahead and mounted the all thread even though I'm still using the original table for now while I'm waiting on my buddy with the water jet to cut the new table parts.

The relief radius on the bottom edge allows clearance for a jam nut on the all thread.



Couple coats of Trim Black spray paint and the platen assembly is ready to mount...



I notched the belt housing cover to clear the right side table mount.



View of the new mount for the right side of the table.





With the stock table mounted and set at 15 degrees...





Now it's the moment of truth. The functionality test with 40 grit ceramic paper. I used @mikey 's instructions and the models to grind a square turning tool example on some 3/8x3/8 key stock. I was impressed with the performance of the sander. The original table is a bit of a pain as the groves are not conducive to grinding something this small but the new table should solve that.

My attempt vs the model. Lots of practice before I have this figured out but I definitely have a tool that is capable now...









For under $200 and a few hours work I am super happy with the result. Hope this helps someone that might want to mod their own!
 

Z2V

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#2
Great job Terry, very well documented. Thanks for the write up.
 

mikey

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#3
Great job on the sander, Terry! Your presentation here is outstanding and should enable others to easily duplicate your work. Please share details of your tool rest when its done - that should be interesting.

We need to see how the sander does with HSS but your tools duplicate the models very accurately - impressive! I have to say that you're taking the new guy thing to another level, Terry!
 

TerryH

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#4
Great job Terry, very well documented. Thanks for the write up.
Thanks! I was so much easier to duplicate the tool with the models. Thanks for taking charge of getting those where they need to be. I'll duplicate the others in the next few days and get these back to you.
 

TerryH

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#5
Great job on the sander, Terry! Your presentation here is outstanding and should enable others to easily duplicate your work. Please share details of your tool rest when its done - that should be interesting.

We need to see how the sander does with HSS but your tools duplicate the models very accurately - impressive! I have to say that you're taking the new guy thing to another level, Terry!
Thanks Mike! Could not have done any of this without your help. I'll add pics and some info once I get the new table. I'm going to wait until then to grind the HSS. More to come...
 

Z2V

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Thanks! I was so much easier to duplicate the tool with the models. Thanks for taking charge of getting those where they need to be. I'll duplicate the others in the next few days and get these back to you.
That’s fine Terry, glad it’s working out for you.
 

ttabbal

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#9
Good stuff! Always nice to see another great tool getting built. Thanks for sharing your work. I think you are on a good track to getting tools ground.
 

TerryH

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#10
Good stuff! Always nice to see another great tool getting built. Thanks for sharing your work. I think you are on a good track to getting tools ground.
Thanks! Once I started using the one you sent me I was hooked. Had to get my sander lined out so I could do my own. Very much appreciate your help.
 

TerryH

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#11
Back at it today with work on the tool rest. I went to my local metal supply this morning and picked up a stick of 10" and 2.5" flat bar. I have a few other things going around in my head which is good because the supply store sells everything in 10' minimums. I used a 10x7 for the rest and 2 - 2.5 x 2.5 pieces for the mounts. Seems like I used every tool in the shop. lol... Really quite a bit to it even though it's a simple project. It apparently required the cold cut saw, portaband, assorted angle grinders/attachments. stationary belt sander, hand held belt sander, drill press, oscillating spindle sander and the MIG. I think it turned out pretty well. Definitely much more substantial and much smoother than the original. I made it a bit wider and longer. I also closed up the opening for the belt as much as possible to maximize support for the work piece.





Slotted mounting brackets so the rest just slides over the all thread. Belt changes take a couple minutes. The 2 mounting points make the table rock solid.





I think it's kinda handsome. :chunky:







I fired it up and knocked out the rest of my models. I'll be sending the models to the next guy on Monday.









A solid and easily repeatable way to have a few preset angles for the rest is still a work in progress. For now I just drew around the brackets with a Sharpie. Seems to work pretty well but I'll devise something else and update when I do. For now this will work. The sander performed very well. Plenty of power and the ceramic belts do great.

I worked on a HSS blank and that is an entirely different animal. Still a work in progress with the HSS. :confused: I get the basic shape without much issue but I need to figure out where to stop in the coarser grits so I don't lose so much as I go finer. More practice....







 
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ttabbal

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#14
Thank you! It's been a fun project. Now if the operator could just perform as well as the machine. :)
Just takes some practice. You're already getting some good tool profiles. And yes, HSS is harder to work than keystock. Try some cobalt when you want a challenge. :)
 

mikey

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#15
The rest came out nice, Terry, and so did your model tools. Jeez, my early tools looked nothing like yours!

HSS is harder to grind, and cobalt is harder still, as @ttabbal implies, but the process is exactly the same. Use your push block, keep the tool shank flat on the tool rest and control the grind.

Grinding tools is a good skill to have and you're off to a great start, but knowing why you're grinding it the way you are is even more important. Jump in on the model tools thread and the guys can help guide you.
 

TerryH

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Just takes some practice. You're already getting some good tool profiles. And yes, HSS is harder to work than keystock. Try some cobalt when you want a challenge. :)
I think I have enough trouble with the HSS for now. :grin:
 

TerryH

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The rest came out nice, Terry, and so did your model tools. Jeez, my early tools looked nothing like yours!

HSS is harder to grind, and cobalt is harder still, as @ttabbal implies, but the process is exactly the same. Use your push block, keep the tool shank flat on the tool rest and control the grind.

Grinding tools is a good skill to have and you're off to a great start, but knowing why you're grinding it the way you are is even more important. Jump in on the model tools thread and the guys can help guide you.
Well you didn't have all this help, models to go by and expert instruction with your first ones. :grin:

Very much to learn but I'm starting to get my head around it. The new rest really helped. I was amazed how well the 120 grit ceramic belts cut the HSS. Not sure that I won't just begin with 80 on the next one. Those ceramic belts are the real deal. I need to pick up some more stock and keep practicing.
 

ttabbal

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#18
I use 36 grit ceramic belts for the first pass, getting most of the material removed. Then switch to finer grits to finish it. The 36 running at high speed can chew even HSS pretty fast.

I agree, without @mikey instructing us, I would still be trying to figure out how to make a decent tool.
 

TerryH

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I use 36 grit ceramic belts for the first pass, getting most of the material removed. Then switch to finer grits to finish it. The 36 running at high speed can chew even HSS pretty fast.

I agree, without @mikey instructing us, I would still be trying to figure out how to make a decent tool.
I have 40, 80 and 120. Amazing to me how quickly they cut the HSS. The new platen probably has something to do with that as well. I definitely need to stop sooner with the 40 and 80 so I leave myself more to work with. Think I might order some 320 also.

I'm really liking this sander. I debated on getting the next one up the Dayton line which was more than twice as much as the one I have. Glad I didn't spend the extra money. This little guy works great after the mods. I'm thinking that the sander will get lots of use on other projects besides the HSS.
 

Ken from ontario

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#20
This is a great write up, easy to understand and follow, I always enjoy modifying anything especially machines, it must have been fun using all the stuff in your shop for this upgrade, and at the end of it all you have one versatile solidly built grinder.
I bet those ceramic belts are great but needing different grits must cost a fortune , but at least we know they last a long time.
 

TerryH

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This is a great write up, easy to understand and follow, I always enjoy modifying anything especially machines, it must have been fun using all the stuff in your shop for this upgrade, and at the end of it all you have one versatile solidly built grinder.
I bet those ceramic belts are great but needing different grits must cost a fortune , but at least we know they last a long time.
Thanks! The belts are only $4 or so each at that link for Empire.
 

chips&more

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#22
Interesting use of glass for the platen. Can you report on how that has worked out for you? Thanks in advance…Dave.
 

Ken from ontario

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TerryH

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#24
Interesting use of glass for the platen. Can you report on how that has worked out for you? Thanks in advance…Dave.
It’s actually a very common platen material especially in the knife making world. Works out very well. It’s super flat, slick and heat resistant. All the qualities of a great platen.
 
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