Missing pump replacement

jpfabricator

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I havent had a chance to do so yet, but I have a 444 international that some one removed and lost the hydrulic pump. I found a new one for $650, but was thinking about fabing a mounting plate to install a cheaper pump of the same rating, i.e. about $400 cheaper. I would like to have some feed back on this project if we have some tractor mechanics out there? What are the pros, cons, Id hate to spend alot of money.:anyone:
 

Terrywerm

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I have found that fabbing up your own replacements can cost you a whole bunch when you go to sell it. Potential buyers see the non-stock items in place of original and then run the other way without even giving you an offer. Another point to consider is that the replacement pump you put on may not be anywhere near the quality of the original, which may lead to early failure, and a resulting total cost that is higher than if you had used the factory part in the first place.

Keep in mind, these are just my opinions based on my experiences, but you are free to do as you like. The desire to save a few bucks is often a valid point, but may bite you in the long run.
 

Rbeckett

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You need to match the volume, efficiency and port flow firection. Haldex, Prince and others make cheaper pumps, but usually the correct pump is used because of the parameters required by the hydraulics. Also you have to insure it is rated for the HP of the application and RPM to avoid wringing off the input shaft or melting the internals. Seen the results of both and trust me it aint pretty and it is a PITA flushing all the particles out of the contaminated system too.
Bob
 

jpfabricator

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The tractor belonged to my wifes grandfather so selling it is not going to happen. The originall pump is nonrebuildable, so it would be a one time ordeall. On the other hand the pump im lookin at is rebuildable. I have done as much reserch as possible on the factory pump but cant find the gpm requirments. The bigest concern I have is the original pump was driven by the timing gears, and im having trouble seeing if the pump was an idler gear or terminal gear. Again its a 44 International gas motor, and any info or input would be much appriciated.
JP
 

Terrywerm

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A little quick research shows that the 444 went through a number of changes during its short production history (1967 - 1971). They were manufactured in England and there were at least four different hydraulic pumps used. I don't know if there were any changes made to the accessory drive of the engine or not, but there very well may have been. There is also a difference between gas and diesel. It's looking like your project may be a bit more involved than first thought, but from what I found most of the pumps were from 4.5 to 9 GPM. Some of them used a tapered shaft for mounting the drive gear, and some used a straight shaft. If yours used a tapered shaft, it may be difficult to find an aftermarket pump that will work, as most of the off the shelf pumps use a straight shaft.

CaseIH still lists parts and complete pumps for all versions of that tractor, but I realize that you are trying to save some money and I cannot say as I blame you. Parts prices have been going through the roof over the last few years. I just put a new pump in a Massey Ferguson 2775. Glad we did the labor ourselves as the pump is located inside the rear end and is no fun to replace, so we saved some money there, but just the pump was $1200. It's an aluminum body and cannot be rebuilt so we hope it lasts a while! The Massey has a somewhat poor system: Hydraulic oil is also the lube oil for the entire rear half of the tractor and it is also shared with the power shift part of the transmission. If one thing goes wrong and contaminates the oil, the whole thing is in jeopardy.

Good luck in your search, hope you manage to find something.

ON EDIT: It appears that the pumps used are as follows:
GAS: 4.5 GPM for tractors with manual steering, and 9 GPM for tractors with power steering.
DIESEL: 7.6 GPM for tractors with manual steering, and 10 GPM for tractors with power steering.
It also appears that the mounting and drive gear are not the same for gas and diesel tractors.

Hope this helps!
 
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