My Abrasive Machine Tool Company Surface Grinder No. 3

[hustlebird]

Hey Everyone,

I brought this machine up in the electrical section, as that was my first priority to fix, but with my mcmaster order submitted I decided to poke around and just talk more generally about it here. I picked up this:

And have been slowly deciphering what's up with it. I got the electrical figured out in this thread here. Today I started evaluating what I saw vs what I have seen in the little documentation I have. The oil system looks ok everywhere that its visible, but it still leaves a huge puddle on the floor almost immediately after pumping it, so I went hunting for the cause. First thing I noticed was the idler is alllll the way to the floor, so I'm gonna have to fix the belt, but I also noticed a hose attached to it.

Any ideas what that hose might be for? Is it just to lubricate the thing? Is this a pump of some sort? The only info I have found in the diagrams is this picture:

Unfortunately I don't have any of the parts mapped to those numbers, just the illustrations, so I'm flying blind as to it's purpose. While a fair number of parts are the same between the No. 3 and the No. 3B, the belt system was reworked between them, so that's one area I wasn't able to pull knowledge from. Anyway, I traced that hose, and found it wasn't hooked into anything, just an unscrewed connector:

So, following the rest of the oil lines, I wiggled my way around the machine, until I got under the table, and was greeted by a ton of oil, and a junction block in the way back.

Is that a connection to nothing back there? I was able to get my phone about halfway in there and snap a bit closer of a shot:

It certainly looks like something belongs there, but I have no idea how to reach it. From where I had access to take this picture its about 3 ft into the casting through a 6x6 hole. Below and to the right there is all the drive equipment for the table feed, and I'm not sure of myself enough to take that out on my own just yet, so I'm not sure what to do just yet at this juncture. My first thought was to just lube up that pulley and cap it with some sort fitting, but now I'm second guessing that it should be hooked up to something. Likewise I'd like to at least plug that hole to make sure everything else is getting the oil it needs, but I guess for now it'll just stay leaking.

The grinder seems in pretty decent shape, to my untrained eye at least. I haven't had a chance to run it yet as I'm waiting on some electrical fixes, but with the tensioner bottomed out the belt is still incredibly loose. I've ordered some alligator lacing to try and shorten it. The current lacing is pretty sketchy anyway. I think once thats fixed it should drive pretty well.

For this oiler system, how high of pressure is it? The hose currently attached looks like it took some belt rubbing to it, but I don't want to sink time into fixing it and not have it completely right. Will medium pressure hose handle it? Thoughts on plugging that block? Not plugging the block? I cant find much of anything online, so I'm posting this to get some info into the world, but I'd gladly take any feedback or knowledge. I'm not a machinist by trade, and this is only my 3rd machine, so plenty to be learned.

 

[hustlebird]

I did snap some pictures of the ways I could see:

 

[matthewsx]

I’d say you’re at the beginning of a lengthy process. Oil piping probably all needs replacing and you’ll probably need to tear it down pretty far to do that.

John

 

[dkemppai]

I did snap some pictures of the ways I could see:

Hmmmm. Does it look like the 'oil' system is a coolant system?

In mine there was a pump mounted externally, it appeared to be used for coolant. All of the ways have rollers that transfer oil from a reservoir filled from oil cups. However this machine was cobbled together a long time ago. It was converted to run an Excello spindle motor so all the original hardware is missing. A second motor was added for the table drivetrain, etc.

I could post pictures, but doubt they'd be helpful...

 

[hustlebird]

Interesting! Which machine do you have? I realize there's a hose thats looped around the oil reservoir in the first picture, but that hose has actually since been pulled, it wasn't attached to that oil pump in any way. There's a whole oil system in there with 2 metering/distribution blocks, one for the front of the machine, one for the back. It branches out to the ways and various gears internally. There was also that rubber hose going to a lube point on the weight/pully tensioner. I suspect it wasn't rated for the pressure, or rubbed against the belt, rendering it useless. my current plan is to just put an oil cup on the tensioner and hopefully plug the open fitting on the oil system.

Sorry, I'm probably butchering all the names of things here, but hopefully that makes sense. I've since had a delivery of a new mill/lathe, and this has sat on the backburner while I get those in place and running. Once the new lathe is operational I'm hoping to tear into this again and get it in running condition. Low on space + resuming work travel has meant not nearly enough time in the garage lately...

I would love to see pictures of another No. 3, especially if its had some modern updates. I believe mine is the original or original spec spindle. Its around 3" tpf, with a 1.25 BE. I believe Abrasive may have used a 2.972" TPF, though I don't really have a good way to measure that accurately.

 

[dkemppai]

Interesting! Which machine do you have?

Hi, I was out of town all last week.

I'll try to get a few pictures. This is a Abrasive No. 3. The 3B's were more common. I've seen a few of those around. Your No. 3 is the only other one I've heard of. The original property tags were on it from the Saginaw, MI Chevrolet plant. I'm assuming it was a tool room machine for them.

The Excello spindle has a motor built onto the spindle shaft. The upgrades are really sort of a hack job. Maybe done in the 50's based on the 'new' spindle. The opening at the rear of the casting opposite the spindle was drilled and cracked away to make room to slip the spindle motor in the head. I"m assuming the head was bored out to accept the 'cartridge' spindle. There is a drip oiler for the spindle, and labyrinth seals to keep dust out. There is a three phase motor for the drive train for the table movement.

I added three phase VFD's to drive the spindle and table drive motors. Mounted a NMEA with the drives, and speed pots on the side of the head. The thing certainly works, although it is a hack job. I paid a few hundred dollars, and slapped some paint on it, and put new bearings in the spindle. The biggest issue is the spindle seems under powered, which is probably my choice of VFD and settings (Maybe it's the high alloy martensitic stainless I tend to grind). But it works, so good enough.

I think the biggest job I did on it was rough dress an mag chuck for a different grinder (No 3 has power feed, the other one doesn't). When I mounted that chuck on the other grinder I didn't even need to dress it on the little grinder. It checked under a 10th over the whole surface. Plenty good for that Chinese machine.

Dan