Planning for our Estate Sale

No , I'm not frustrated ACH , I'm done . I don't have to worry or think about this any more . I can make a living on my own from this point on . Yes , skilled mechanics and machinists are in large demand . Trouble is there are none , so we have to pull double and triple duty to keep things alive . You probably don't follow my posts , but this has been going on for years .

We have 6 mechanics for 2 large plants that run 24/7 . I can't take a vacation day without finding a replacement for me per my manager . Uh , well just where am I going to find a replacement ? :grin:

We hire temps . Management pays them $9 an hour maybe . They come and they go , don't give a crap and should they ? We had 2 guys start 3 months ago , one of which I was supposed to try and train . We asked how him how long have you been in the mechanical trade and his response was an hour and a half . After 2 1/2 months here , the only tool he owned was a cell phone . He took the tools I supplied him home and never brought them in to work . His ash is GONE ! But hey , that's not a problem , we have a temp now that came from KFC , I'm sure he is top notch ! Oh , wait . He walked into a meeting earlier this week , throws his butt down in a chair in the middle of all of us , not wearing a mask and proclaims he has Covid symptems , his ash is gone too .

Gotta wonder where our next candidates are coming from . I now find this amusing because I just don't care either . It hurts , but it's not my problem . This country and company leaders sold skilled labor out years ago , and now they'll pay the piper . :clapping:
 
Ah, the benefits of being self employed. Not easy but on my own now for 23 years. 11 well paid employees and still growing. I'm good.........
 
mmcmdl said:
No , I'm not frustrated ACH , I'm done . I don't have to worry or think about this any more . I can make a living on my own from this point on . Yes , skilled mechanics and machinists are in large demand . Trouble is there are none , so we have to pull double and triple duty to keep things alive . You probably don't follow my posts , but this has been going on for years .

We have 6 mechanics for 2 large plants that run 24/7 . I can't take a vacation day without finding a replacement for me per my manager . Uh , well just where am I going to find a replacement ? :grin:

We hire temps . Management pays them $9 an hour maybe . They come and they go , don't give a crap and should they ? We had 2 guys start 3 months ago , one of which I was supposed to try and train . We asked how him how long have you been in the mechanical trade and his response was an hour and a half . After 2 1/2 months here , the only tool he owned was a cell phone . He took the tools I supplied him home and never brought them in to work . His ash is GONE ! But hey , that's not a problem , we have a temp now that came from KFC , I'm sure he is top notch ! Oh , wait . He walked into a meeting earlier this week , throws his butt down in a chair in the middle of all of us , not wearing a mask and proclaims he has Covid symptems , his ash is gone too .

Gotta wonder where our next candidates are coming from . I now find this amusing because I just don't care either . It hurts , but it's not my problem . This country and company leaders sold skilled labor out years ago , and now they'll pay the piper . :clapping:
Click to expand...


What you are talking about is happening in many areas of business. I spend my first 9 years at Boeing in Supply Management as a Procurement Financial Analyst, doing negotiations and evaluation of the contract with MHI on the 787 wings. At first I was working around people that had been in SM for 30 years and very knowledgeable. But the last 4-5 years, they started hiring the young college grads in, setting them down in a chair and handing them huge contracts to manage. We are talking hundreds of millions of dollar contracts. They don't want to learn the technical aspects of the product and don't care if they negotiate reasonable settlements on design changes. Not a clue. All they are worried about is how they can move up.

There are five levels of employees, only a few of the most knowledgeable make it to level 5. It takes years and there are only a hand full out of 300 some people in Finance. Now management wants to eliminate all the level 5's and the new level 5 is a level 4. Which they want to reduce to a hand full. A level 1 is someone out of college, level 2 knows only a little more and maybe has a year in. Level 3's will be the new level 4 and are about as worthless as goose sh*t on a pump handle.

Makes no sense to me. They are saving a lot of money on paper for salaries and benefits but is costing the company millions in poor management of their supply chain.
 
My "death plan" is an auction for the stuff left over after our son takes what he wants. I belong to a collecting club called the "A. C. Gilbert Heritage Society" which is a group of around 400 old-farts who mainly collect Erector sets. The club hosts an annual convention which is usually attended by 60+ members. Around 10 years ago, the tables tilted from mostly "display/show off" to "for sale". I'm 60 and am one of the youngest members of the group. The topic of conversation at shows is "what am I gonna do with all of this junk"!

I had a buddy who passed away 10 years ago who had a pretty large toy train collection. Had a 40-foot wall in his basement with 15 or so rows of track on the wall for storage; it was full of Marx, American Flyer and other cars/engines. They had an estate sale after his death that was attended by 5 or 6 people. Why? Because no one who saw the auction ads cared about buying toy trains. It's an old toy that was huge in the 1930's - 1950's, but pretty much died out by the 1960's. The guys who are interested in that stuff are getting up there also and are in the "disposal" facet of collecting, not the "accumulation" phase.

My wife and I went to a woodworking shop closing/auction in 1992. This was before the internet, read about it in a local newspaper. Looked at a paper map (remember those?) for directions. Came up on the intersection on the gravel road and looked left, nothing down there. Looked right and the cars and trucks were lined up on either side of the road. Pulled behind a truck and walked 200 yards to the auction. I was interested in a Delta Unisaw or something similar. Guys were packed 4 or 5 deep around every piece of equipment. There were all age groups there from 20-somethings to octogenarians. Told my wife "there will be no deals here today" with the 500 or so people at the auction, so we left.

Point being, on the plus side for our family survivors, there is a market for our shops and tools. Not that I'd expect a line of cars and trucks 1/4 mile down the road from our place for my eventual estate auction, but there are still millenials who are interested in this stuff. We fortunately see it on this forum all of the time, young guys (and gals) who get a hankerin' to make something, so the hobby continues.

On the other hand, like I tell the Erector set guys who lament the fact that our toy market is really soft right now (much more supply than demand), if you bought it as a retirement investment, just accept the fact that you invested poorly and move on. I probably have $40K or more tied up in my shop and did not buy it with the intent of selling it off for a profit. We're pretty blessed as a family and what's in my pole barn is a drop in the bucket of our net worth. Sure, wouldn't want to give it away, but really wouldn't care as long as it's going to a good home of a future hobby machinist. After all, this will probably happen when I'm no longer able to enjoy my shop or need to downsize. It'd give me a chance to tell my boring hobby machinist stories to another group of guys and gals. I bought a Grizzly G0709 14" x 40" lathe around 4 years ago new for $4500. Have since added a DRO, 5C collet closer, taper attachment, 40+ quick change tool holders, 8" set-tru chuck, etc. Probably have $8000 into that lathe and would expect to get maybe $4000 for the package as it sets. I bought it to play with, not as investment.

Bruce

p.s. There ACGHS club had an affluent member named John Drury who was the lead news anchor at the ABC station in Chicago for 40 years. John was a 7-figure a year guy. If you saw "jdrury@mindspring.net" bidding on something on eBay, you WERE NOT going to get it as he paid more in taxes a year than most of us made. John retired in around 2002 and was soon diagnosed with ALS. When he got to the point of not being able to look at his collection anymore, it was auctioned off. I recall adding up the total off everything at around $400K. John spent much more than that on this stuff but knew he couldn't take it with him and was satisfied it was all going to good homes.


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John Drury Erector & Mysto Magic Auction 2005-10-09 Auction - 519 Price Results - Freeman's | Hindman in IL

See 519 prices and auction results for John Drury Erector & Mysto Magic Auction on Oct 09, 2005 by Freeman's | Hindman in IL
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Gr8legs,
I’m glad you brought up this subject. There are some great ideas in this thread!
I like the idea of taking a pic of the item, adding some descriptive information to place in the add and a value range.
Simple and very helpful to my loved ones that will have to deal with it.
My wife agreed there are some great ideas. She also said, you’ll never do it.
Hmmmmm, she may be right.
I bet when I retire I’ll find the time.
 
About a year ago, my wife asked, if anything happened to me, what was she going to do with the stuff in the shop, apparently my answer of it wont be my problem, I’ll be dead, was not the answer she was looking for. I got the cold shoulder special for a day or two, she then suggested an inventory, I said I did not have enough years left to do it, she shook her head and walked away.

My step-son would only be interested in the cash if sold, my daughter has no interest, he boyfriend sure does, the grandkids would have absolutely no interest. So I did give the wife a list of machining friends, that would be interested in helping in the liquidation, When I asked them to help her if the need arose, they then roped me in to do the same for them. So hopefully there will be assistance for her.

I told her if it happens the other way, a large dumpster was going to be the answer for me.
 
Going back to valuation. I have other hobbies, which includes repair of antique fountain pens (hence the need for machining tools), and antique/vintage China collecting. My wife has no clue on the valuation of these items. I have started (on my computer) a valuation list. The Valuation has a minimum sale price, a typical sale price, and a higher end price. My spouse can decide how fast she wants to sell the item, and chose the price which is applicable. The Catalog has the name/make/model/etc of the item, a picture of the item, notes about when and where the item is from, PICTURES of the items (which would be included in the advertisement), and a Description which would be run with the advertisement. The Description includes any additional information on what makes the item especially desirable or limitations the item might have. I update it each time I get a new item. Periodically, the list is burned to a CD (in case my computer crashes in an unrecoverable fashion). Some of the antique pens have a small paper adhesive tag on them, which has a unique "identity number". This prevents two pens which "look identical" from being confused; some are only gold filled, others are solid gold... obviously a big difference in rarity and value.

Currently, my investment in machining tools is small (less than $6000), so I am not too concerned (yet). But if it tips over the 10k point, it will get a catalog as well.
 
I think the important thing to remember here is the ones who are left behind with our stuff....

If we love them, asking them to be estate sale coordinators when we are gone might not be a very kind thing to do regardless of how valuable our possessions are. Those who have lost someone know how difficult it can be to deal with just the legal and financial aspects of even a very well organized person. In our cases we're putting literally tons of greasy iron and steel on top of that load should we pass without a solid plan to deal with it.

Those who have time to pare down and make sure valuable items go to people who will appreciate them definitely should but too many of us put things off until it's too late. A truly kind hobby machinist should discuss this with their loved ones and make sure whatever you are planning is something they will be able to accomplish in their darkest hour.

The best plan for many is probably to eliminate stuff that isn't used while you can still enjoy the proceeds with your family. Maybe a "sold the horizontal mill trip to visit the grandkids" or a "shaper proceeds family reunion", you get the idea. These difficult times are bringing what matters most into much sharper focus for many and discussions like this are a necessary part of everyone's life. We all know the time will come when it will truly be too late so why not make it easier on those left behind.

John
 
Although the intent of this thread has to do with final disposal of equipment, there have been some nice thoughtful comments about the nature of the workforce. I can't help but be enticed by the topic.

My first theory on this: The musical artist Madonna had it right; a person needs to re-invent themselves about once every decade or so. I started in Electronics, drifted to Machining, then back to electronics and design. When fewer places needed new electronic design and prototyping (a lot of it started to go off-shore), I switched to computers and network engineering, then to being a college instructor, and finally, back to network test engineering. Don't get me wrong, electronics and machining have always remained on the back burner as a hobby the whole time.

As a person who has been "tapped" to perform interviews I have noticed some changes over the years. Many of the guys who were "only" considered Machinists in the 70s and 80s, would be thought of as "tool and die" makers today. Many of they guys who were "only" engineering technicians/electronic technicians in the 70s and 80s, would totally stomp what graduates from college with EE degrees today. The available pool of employees appear to be "procedural thinkers" as versus "critical thinkers" or, even better, "outside the box thinkers". They don't understand the nuts and bolts of what is trying to be achieved, they don't know how to adjust or make corrections, they cannot spot the mis-match between the procedures they are following, and what they are trying to actually achieve. These limitations are seen across ALL career fields, and not just machining.
I took a few college courses about a decade back. They were from a high-end University. I could not help but notice the rigor had disappeared from the classroom. I had Junior College classes taken in the 70s, which were far tougher and had more rigor than these University classes; it made me sad. Considering that college graduates are the current supply pool for many of the job fields these days, the resulting outcome is not surprising.

How did we get here? It is easy to explain. Colleges "created" degrees in "human resources/management". They enforced the concept that you can only be good at some things, IF you have a degree. Those graduates with human resource degrees got hired by major companies. Those hiring managers started using a "degree" as a major filtering element on "who" gets hired. It became a self-feeding mechanism after that. As time passed, and rigor reduced in education, it became a mechanism which ate it's own flesh. Silently, and largely unnoticed, a few companies maintained the mantra "hire smart and ethical, and train skill". Those companies required an "old salt who knew the craft" to perform the interviews (and train). For those who got hired by those companies, they saw career progression, raises and opportunity. If they were hired elsewhere, they saw themselves being limited (not based upon what they could do for their companies) but instead, based upon what education they had.

I do not expect any of these trends to change. In the engineering field, I would pick a good generalist, over 3 specialists every time.
 
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I was fortunate to get hired about a month ago into a job that I would call an IT Generalist, official title is Technology Analyst, it's for a government agency so maybe that explains why the are so behind.

I can't speak to what colleges and universities are doing but my daughter just graduated with an engineering degree and seems to have a fairly good grasp of the diversity of work she will be required to do.

I suspect more than anything, corporations being driven by accounting is responsible for this trend. By breaking every job down into it's elements and only requiring people to have the specific skill for that one aspect they can improve financial results in the short term without building the skilled workforce needed in the past. Outsourcing and offshoring further enhanced this trend to the point where I have several different resumes which only focus on one aspect of my experience because knowing more stuff is often seen as a liability these days (they know you're old).

Smart companies will continue to cross train their employees and encourage diversification as a means to build resiliency, they may win in the long run but only time will tell....

John
 
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