Trouble refitting Honden (Grizzly G0731) Mill Quill

[Dave022]

As part of the cleanup of my mill I took the head apart. I am now having trouble refitting the quill.

I understand that clearances are very tight on these. I have tried putting it in the freezer but still cant get it in. Are there any techniques for aligning and refitting these?

 

[Richard King 2]

https://cdn0.grizzly.com/partslists/g0731_pl.pdfy

I found thin on the Grizzly site. I would buy a medium grit round or 1/2 round lapping stone and stone everything, especally on the ends of the qill and inside the housing bottom bearing retainer... If you over tightened the spindle retainer collar # 131 you may have swedged it a bit. On some of the bigger machines like a Bridgeport they have a set screw that if you tighten it it makes the quill get egg shaped a bit. be sure to NOT hit on it with a hammer. Just treat it like a baby and be patient. I have had this problem before, so it happens...clean it good too. Im not a big fan of freezing it as it can get warm and water will evaporate and might get rusty. I hope you did not over tighten the spindle bearings did you?

 

[Dave022]

https://cdn0.grizzly.com/partslists/g0731_pl.pdfy

I found thin on the Grizzly site. I would buy a medium grit round or 1/2 round lapping stone and stone everything, especally on the ends of the qill and inside the housing bottom bearing retainer... If you over tightened the spindle retainer collar # 131 you may have swedged it a bit. On some of the bigger machines like a Bridgeport they have a set screw that if you tighten it it makes the quill get egg shaped a bit. be sure to NOT hit on it with a hammer. Just treat it like a baby and be patient. I have had this problem before, so it happens...clean it good too. Im not a big fan of freezing it as it can get warm and water will evaporate and might get rusty. I hope you did not over tighten the spindle bearings did you?

Unfortunately I already refitted using hot-cold method. It now has smooth travel in the mid range but will only extend approx 70 mm and will not retract further than 5 mm (by the scale on the head) therefore it will need to come out again. What would you propose the best way forward is from here. I planned to map the quill and bore using micrometers and telescoping gauges; but I'm not sure how accurate this would be?

How hard is the quill? Is the only method to sand the bore or could the quill be set in a lathe if it is deformed? I'm concerned that if there is any difference is quill roundness then sand the bore to fit the largest diameter may cause slop over the whole fit?

Nothing was overtightened so not sure how this happened, it came out fine...

 

[Richard King 2]

It just didn't grow sitting on the bench when it was apart. Do you have a micrometer to mike the quill? You need to do that and measure 6 to 8 places around the circumference of the tight area and every 1" up the quill. I know you said it doesn't have a burr or you over tightened anything, but something made it get tight as I said it didn't magically grow. If you have any tube bluing or if you don't get some lip-stick and dab on some around the area that gets tight and rub it smooth so it is transparent so you can see the metal under it. Use a rubber glove or use you bare fingers. then move it up and down. Also check the rack and rack pinion for burrs. I would NOT sand down the OD to fix a screw up. 2 wrongs do not make it right. Oh by the way, did you see what I do? I am a a professional machine rebuilder and have seen things like this before. I have seen the bottom of a quill get tight when the hobbyist or first timer over tightens that cap and it expands the quill making it get tight the last few inches as you described. You did something by not reinstalling the bearings or cap or burred it up somehow. Have to be patient and pull it apart and figure it out. If it would move up and down OK before it DOES no need to be sanded! How about some pictures....?

 

[Dave022]

Oh by the way, did you see what I do? I am a a professional machine rebuilder and have seen things like this before.

I did see that; and I very much appreciate your advice. I'm also not suggesting that I did anything wrong as I obviously did; I just don't know what I did exactly, nor when unfortunately.

Do you have a micrometer to mike the quill? You need to do that and measure 6 to 8 places around the circumference of the tight area and every 1" up the quill.

I do have a micrometer and that is what I was getting at by 'mapping' the quill, I will be using the method you have described.

The issue I think I have now is removing the quill again, as I used temp difference to get it in and it is tight at the both ends of its range of movement. I'm really grateful for your help though and am keen on being patient as I don't want to fix it the right way and not make it worse!

I plan on taking some pictures when I take it apart so will post them as soon as I do.

 

[Richard King 2]

Try it at room temp as the freeze method can create moisture and rust. Use light oil, like gun or 3 in 1 oil spread inside the quill sparingly. If you are take it apart, try the quill alone without the spindle and cap.

 

[Dave022]

Try it at room temp as the freeze method can create moisture and rust. Use light oil, like gun or 3 in 1 oil spread inside the quill sparingly. If you are take it apart, try the quill alone without the spindle and cap.

I removed the spindle and all other parts and tried oil but it did not come out easily; I had to press it out slowly and carefully as i could as I didn't want to use percussive force.

I started taking measurements today and think I can see an issue:

	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8
0	80.23	80.06	80.025	80.05	80.18	80.1	80	80.03
1	80.03	79.98	79.98	79.98	80.03	79.98	80	79.98
2	X	X	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.97	X
3	X	X	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98	X
4	X	X	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98	X
5	X	X	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98	X
6	X	X						X
7	X	X						X
8	X	X						X
9	X	X						X
10	X	X						X
11	X	X						X
12	X	X						X
13	X	X						X
14	X	X						X
15	X	X						X
16	79.97	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98
17	79.97	79.98	79.99	79.99	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98
18	79.97	79.98	79.98	79.99	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98
19	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.99	79.98	79.98	79.98	79.98
20	80.01	80.09	80.025	80.01	80.14	80.19	80.1	80.07

The columns are 8 equally spaced measuring points around the circumference starting at rack in position 1 (this is why the positions on the actual rack are marked with an X), the rows are 10mm spacings down the quill with position 1 and 20 being centred on the very top and bottom



I do plan to finish measuring the rest of the quill but it appears there is significant deformation at the top and some at the bottom as well.





If the rest of the quill turns out to be fine what should I do from here. I am assuming that I carefully sand the quill back to dimension but as the measurement is covering two opposite sides how do I determine which side I need to sand?

 

[Dave022]

The rest of the quill comes in at 79.98 as well. I checked the bore with telescoping gauges and it measures 80 dead on so looks like somewhere between 0.01 - 0.02 mm clearance

 

[Richard King 2]

Above the # 1 , the quill looks hammer dented. Also the ID of the quill looks rusty. You nay want to biy a spring hone and polish it before sanding don the uill.

 

[Dave022]

I think you are right about the dent above #1; I was thinking of closer mapping this area to see any extent of deformation and remove material from there first?