Wanting to make a barrel for H&R break top rifle

[SEK_22Hornet]

Barrel Profiling suggestions?

Having been bit by the Handi Rifle bug, I have bought a couple H&R single shot break barrel rifles - on is an older original H&R model 157 22 Hornet with Manlicher stock and the other three being modern NEF era guns - a 45 LC Classic Carbine, a 45-70 Buffalo Classic (32" barrel) and a 17HMR rimfire. I had the factory fit a 22 Hornet barrel to the Classic Carbine and reamed it to 22 K hornet and planned on sending it back for a .357 mag barrel, that I intended to ream to .357 Max and cut it to match the 20" 45 LC barrel, adding open sights to match the 45 LC. Problem is, H&R / Remington just shut down the accessory barrel program without any warning. So One of my projects is to attempt to duplicate the contour of the 45 LC barrel, machine a barrel lug to match and weld it to the new barrel, which will most likely be a .357 caliber. So, as a novice machinist, I have several challenges. Barrel stubbing is a popular method of making barrels for these rifles - you cut off a shotgun barrel, bore it out and thread in a blank and go. But that still leaves me wanting to match the contour of the barrel. Any thoughts on a fairly simple way to duplicate a barrel contour on a lathe? My lathe is a Harrison L6 with the taper attachment, but the taper bare is only about a foot long, and it still would not let me duplicate the rounded contours at the chamber end.

I will probably end up making more than one barrel if I am successful....

Welding questions to come later...

Dan

 

[Dbingen]

Basically, you can cut the barrel down to within 0.005-0.010" final diameter at about 1" intervals along the barrel. Make the cuts about 1/4" wide using a sharp parting tool. Then you can connect the cuts with a high speed tool that is very sharp. Clean it up with files and sandpaper. It's a tedious job, but it can be done.

...David

 

[mainspring]

Dan,

Yes you can use your taper attachment. Measure your sample bbl for a careful given length,
and measure the diameters at the large and small end. Now do the little trig calculation to get
the angle. If you aren't familiar with it, post your dimensions, and i'll help you.
Set your taper attachment to the angle. Likely it will be only a degree or two.
Then, with the big end of the blank in the chuck, and the muzzle in the tailstock,
Start cutting the taper towards the tailstock. That way, if you have a problem,
or the tool starts to dig, it is not digging into a larger diameter and causing a problem.
Cut in sections and keep moving the taper attachment toward the chuck.
When the bbl taper is pretty close, up to the transition where it enlarges into the
chamber reinforce, stop turning, and make a card or tin template of the curves.
Layout the curve on top of a high speed tool bit, and grind to the curve outline.
Use a Dremel or hand stone to smooth the forming tool you just made.
At low RPM in the lathe, form the inside curve of the transition, using plenty of oil
Try and for a smooth junction between your machine cut taper, and the formed radius.

The outside radius can be roughed out with a 45 degree tool and hand filed to shape at medium
speed.

For barrel profile turning, especially on small diameters, most 'smiths like to use a sharp
High speed steel tool, instead of a carbide, due to lower tool pressure. Be sure there is a small radius
on the nose of your left hand turning tool. By left hand, i mean the tool cuts from left to right.


This isn't very hard to do. A little tedious on the set up maybe.
You will probably want to turn your breech section to diameter, before starting the tapering.

The locking block is not too complex, and fairly easy if you have a decent mill, with a good vise.

If you need more detail or instruction, post your questions. Or send me a personal message.
I've been a working gunsmith/ engineer for the last 25 years, and still teach occasional classes in this stuff.











Phil

 

[CannonFodder]

Re: Barrel Profiling suggestions?

Having been bit by the Handi Rifle bug, I have bought a couple H&R single shot break barrel rifles - on is an older original H&R model 157 22 Hornet with Manlicher stock and the other three being modern NEF era guns - a 45 LC Classic Carbine, a 45-70 Buffalo Classic (32" barrel) and a 17HMR rimfire. I had the factory fit a 22 Hornet barrel to the Classic Carbine and reamed it to 22 K hornet and planned on sending it back for a .357 mag barrel, that I intended to ream to .357 Max and cut it to match the 20" 45 LC barrel, adding open sights to match the 45 LC. Problem is, H&R / Remington just shut down the accessory barrel program without any warning. So One of my projects is to attempt to duplicate the contour of the 45 LC barrel, machine a barrel lug to match and weld it to the new barrel, which will most likely be a .357 caliber. So, as a novice machinist, I have several challenges. Barrel stubbing is a popular method of making barrels for these rifles - you cut off a shotgun barrel, bore it out and thread in a blank and go. But that still leaves me wanting to match the contour of the barrel. Any thoughts on a fairly simple way to duplicate a barrel contour on a lathe? My lathe is a Harrison L6 with the taper attachment, but the taper bare is only about a foot long, and it still would not let me duplicate the rounded contours at the chamber end.

I will probably end up making more than one barrel if I am successful....

Welding questions to come later...

Dan

Seems like setting up some kind of pattern-following system is the first option. Here is an illustration of it, the presentation has more than one part.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFyBWSXjmY0

CannonFodder

 

[SEK_22Hornet]

Thanks for the suggestions - I need to play with some scrap before I dive in and ruin a barrel blank - Mainspring - one area of concern I have is welding the lug to the barrel - I have a stick type AC welder - I've seen lots of comments about how hard 4140 is to weld. Any thoughts on that part of the project? I was thinking about a low hydrogen electrode.

 

[Holescreek]

Instead of the stick welder I think I'd go with silver solder or braze.

 

[normks]

I went down this road a couple years ago made a stub and lug screwed a barrel and tapered it straight. trying to weld a barrel seemed like a hard task to heat up and cool down slow enough after welding. every thing was 4140 annealed tig welded has not fell apart yet.

 

[SEK_22Hornet]

normks - thanks for the suggestions and the photo - that is a direction I have considered. I noticed that one of the on-line metal suppliers has 4130 tubing in several sizes and wall thicknesses. I figured the 4130 might be a little easier to weld and should still be plenty strong enough to work for the calibers I'm thinking about. What caliber did you build with yours? I'd love to eventually build a .327 Mag, .357 Max, and maybe a 32-20. I would need to find someone to TIG weld the lug on, since all I have3 available is stick. Did you build the lug to use standard extractor or ejector parts?

I'm guessing you are right up 169 highway from me.

 

[normks]

sec I did make the lug it was 5/8 square stock I made the extractor duplicating the nef and also the extractor cam. I did buy roll pins and a lifting spring under the extractor from numeric. I didn't photo every process of it was a 9/32 channel for the extractor and a 1/4 wide face running up the barrel. I made a template of the lug and traced it to the 5/8 steel to cut the locking contacts out side barrel dimensions must be same as factory for lug to be any ways close to center. I chambered in 25-20 my stub was 1 1/4 4140 solid drilled taped to 3/416 could easily been 7/8 or bigger more metal less distortion during weld. after drilling stub it was put between centers to take it to the finish dia. weld on the stub leave proud to the rear and face off to fit the action. screw in a barrel face off to get good snug lock up making sure the shelf has about 3/4 lock up on the latch put back in the lathe chamber it cut a extractor slot with a key way cutter. any thing I can answer for ya let me know . there is a old thread http://www.hobby-machinist.com/showthread.php/12627-nef-lug-and-stub
.

 

[Archangel]

Wow, old but still relevant post!
I ordered a 16" Green Mountain .311 barrel blank to try making a 7.62x54R accessory barrel for my AAC 300BLK Handy Rifle.
Now i think i should have gone with 22" to 24" length.
I have way too much 54R ammo and only one Mosin to shoot it out of so there's a good reason.
Rather than thread a stub (that I don't have) my thought was to use a piece of (4140?) Pipe that matches the frame perfectly and turn the barrel od a few thousands too big so as to have an interface fit as the outer pipe cools onto the frozen barrel.
Perhaps even leaving a raised ring on both ends of the barrel to trap pipe on the barrel and blend in when smoothing the overall OD.
The lug can be welded to the pipe before installing it, then put in the oven to stress relieve the weld job and to heat for installation onto the barrel.
I have the barrel, pipe, and made a workable lug with extractor.
Then machine off the excess on the back to get the barrel to lock up properly, then cut the chamber to proper head space.

I get a solid lug weld that does nothing to the barrel heat wise, and can tap the scope base and not intrude into the barrel

All I need is a $3500 lathe and $350 in one time use chamber reamer with other gun machining accessories.
To do this for others I'm sure I'd need a manufacturer FFL and what not.