Boyer Shultz 6x12 rebuild

[Bob Korves]

So after clean up and inspection I noticed something maybe someone knows. My machine a BS h612 challenger. Circa late 70’s. I’ve read in earlier and my manual that as a option hardened ground and scraped ways. I’m no expert by any means but when I look at the “scraped” surface. To me it’s been ground and flaked. All marks are connected by the tail of flaking process. The pattern is crisscrossed and way to repetitive for scraping to me. I know I should post pictures but I’m not there now I will do so later. Any thoughts.
Another thing looking in the manual it says the vertical column is lubed from the oiling system. I cannot see a path that the oil would get to the vertical ways. Unless they use the bevel gear oil line and it just gravity drips through gear,and thrust bearing area eventually overflowing off plate and mysteriously finding its way to the ways????
Was just wondering for reassembly if I should put a thin film of grease on column then let whatever drip. Again any thoughts??

I have not seen ground and flaked surfaces. If they are hardened and ground, they are left that way. Often when scraped surfaces are well worn, the flaking is still visible but the scraping is gone because is is shallower. You could check with a file in a safe place to check for hardened surfaces. I strongly do not recommend using grease on any of the ways of a surface grinder (or any other machine.) The grease will collect grit, which turns it into lapping paste. Use way oil, liberally.

 

[Cadillac]

I agree about the grit sticking to the grease but would oil attract the same. Other than dripping. I have all guards and will be in place maybe some graphite spray that dries. I use it all the time for clutch Assy. And works good there.???
I wasn’t clear in the flaking. On the underside of my table there are harden inserts factory that are looks to be epoxied. I’ve read somewhere when a guy ripped them off with a chisel and brought his machine back into a comfortable tolerance for him. Idk about that!
Then the opposing surfaces are ground then appears to be flaked. Idk if you can see in the pictures but you can see the machining marks below the flaking

 

[Bob Korves]

From a guy who just learned to flake last week from Richard King, that flaking looks like amateur work (and much like my first attempts.) Flaking helps to hold pockets of oil, which a ground surface to another ground surface does not. Way oil tends to stop stick-slip, helps to flush grit out if it is used regularly, keeps rust away, and reduces friction immensely. Follow the manufacturer's recommendations or ask grinder hands with long term experience and who are familiar with your machine.

 

[Ulma Doctor]

So after clean up and inspection I noticed something maybe someone knows. My machine a BS h612 challenger. Circa late 70’s. I’ve read in earlier and my manual that as a option hardened ground and scraped ways. I’m no expert by any means but when I look at the “scraped” surface. To me it’s been ground and flaked. All marks are connected by the tail of flaking process. The pattern is crisscrossed and way to repetitive for scraping to me. I know I should post pictures but I’m not there now I will do so later. Any thoughts.
Another thing looking in the manual it says the vertical column is lubed from the oiling system. I cannot see a path that the oil would get to the vertical ways. Unless they use the bevel gear oil line and it just gravity drips through gear,and thrust bearing area eventually overflowing off plate and mysteriously finding its way to the ways????
Was just wondering for reassembly if I should put a thin film of grease on column then let whatever drip. Again any thoughts??

Hey Cadi,
i have BS H618 Challenger 1979
i got the impression myself that the ways are ground and flaked, but i could be mistaken.
i'll pull my table off tomorrow and inspect closer.
my unit has oil tubes and fittings and supply pipes that supply oil. there is an electric pump that slowly pumps oil every so often.
i'm not sure of the intricacies of the pump flow rate- but i'm imagining a few drops per hour maybe?

i can post pictures if that would be helpful, if you have missing hardware, etc.

i would not use grease for the simple reason that grease traps grit horribly, oil tends to flow grit away in comparison

 

[Cadillac]

Alittle update I finally got her broke in and just waiting to finish a vacuum setup. I added a coolant tank in the lower compartment with a nice little coolant nozzle setup made from some fitting and snaploc fittings. I think I'm gonna paint the bottom of the table. It's missing a lot of original paint exposing the cast and I don't want it rusting using the coolant. I don't believe they very used coolant previously. I have a nice 350 cfm squirrel cage blower fan I hope will pull enough suction. I haven't decided on if mounting to mount on end of table or off the backside of wheel guard. I think the smaller type off wheel guard will give a better suction?
I finally got the vfd and all the wiring for breakers for vac and coolant system. Vfd gave me a fight on programming. The other teco vfd's I did all the par,a meters for motor and such were correct. I had to change a lot and went to sensorless vector drive. I did a run in on the motor and spindle to maybe realign the spindle bearings and distribute the grease and not just fling it off. The spindle seems perfect! Nice and quiet no measurable movement on both end of taper. I'm very happy how it's going. I've been alittle side tracked on the tool and cutter grinder I bought. I've scraped a ton of cosmoline crap of everywhere. I disassembled the whole thing down to nuts and bolts cleaned reassembled and just waiting on a tool base cabinet to mount it too. I'll get some pics of the surface grinde when I get a chance.

 

[sparkness]

So after a little more research and memory refresh I remember that a shielded bearing runs cooler than a sealed type. And drag on spindle from seals maybe even harmonics from the seal. So I’m guessing but that’s when they don’t use sealed in a direct drive spindle. Turns out I have a dozen or so 6203zzc3 bearings NOS nsk in sealed bags.
Now the question is I know these new bearings are at least 10 yr old. Do I worry about the shelf life of the grease in the bearings. I’ve already pulled the shields on the original bearings cleaned and reassembled one side of shields. Can even tell where I pryed. I straightened them easily.
So I’ve been researching what grease to repack in the cleaned spindle and in the motor bearings. 99% of what I saw was kluber I forgot the rest but easy to find. So I need to order some of that. I figure for the 30 bucks at least it will give me the best results on cleaning and repacking the bearings. Anything else out there that’s comparable?

the spindle should be using super precision bearings ABEC7 or p4 grade not plain abec3 bearings. Cost will be about $75-100 on ebay. Assembly is critical, preheat inner races cool spindle in freezer, and make appropriate tools to press back together. here is link explaining proper assembly.
https://feyc.eu/download/aplicacion...eToolSpindleBearingSelectionMountingGuide.pdf

 

[Grandpop]

I have a Boyar Shultz Deluxe with the hardened ways. The hard ways are bolted to the top of the saddle V and flat ways; they are not flaked, just ground. The bottom of the table is just cast iron and is scraped/flaked. Never saw and scraping/flaking on hardened portions

 

[Grandpop]

The oil of mine drips down to to center top of casting. Little groves carry it to the bevel gear/screw and the 4 slide ways.

 

[Sblack]

Kudos for concentrating on mechanics and foregoing paint. I see so many "restoration" threads where the emphasis is on shiny and the machine doesn't work any better than before. It is a lot harder to scrape in a machine and fix all the mechanical issues than it is to do a paint job, even a good one.

 

[Cadillac]

The only place I painted was the table inside area. All the paint was gone in the “tray area” so I cleaned and put acouple coats of rustoleum machine grey. It almost a match. I plan on using coolant and I wanted it to be painted so it didn’t rust. Other than that I wouldn’t want to mess with bondo and such. Original paint gives character and last I checked a shiny paint job gets u no better performance or precision.