Opinions on surface grinder from Facebook Market place.

[DavidR8]

Thanks for the reply.

What are drive bands? Was it expensive replacement? Easily found online?
I will make sure I can power it up and spin for a test.

Drive bands are used to drive the table. Not expensive but tricky to install correctly. Special order from Parker Majestic.

 

[Unix]

There is no such thing . You have to dress your wheels . Any of the above will hold tenths but the operator controls the machine . I take it you're just starting out in the machining journey ?

Thank for the reply.

I know about the dressing and requiring to do careful wheel balancing.
I plan on getting special wheel balancing ring adapters which will attach to the grinding wheel.

Yes, I am a beginner, but have been reading and watching on the subject for years religiously.
Now it's time to stop reading and watching, get my hand dirty with water soluble cutting fluid and machining oil.

I will take some metrology courses before doing anything which have homework and exams and I'll read books how to operate each machine.
Here is the metrology course I plan to take (I have watched the entire course last year, it's the only best hands of metrology self teaching guide on the internet):

Pragmatic Metrology

Free training videos on inspection and metrology with calipers, micrometers, surface plate equipment, angle gages, thread gages, and more.

www.pragmaticmetrology.com

One of my favorites is Steve from Solid Rock on YouTube, he truly inspires me to do high precision tasks:

I have spoken with dozens of tool-and-die machinists on FB Marketplace, they have a complete arsenal of metrology tools which I plan to buy the bulk of it.

 

[Unix]

Drive bands are used to drive the table. Not expensive but tricky to install correctly. Special order from Parker Majestic.

Thanks for the reply.

Alright, I think I know what you mean, its like a belt to traverse the table. Good to know.

 

[mmcmdl]

Next time I go thru Buffalo I'll stop by to see some progress ,

 

[projectnut]

Thanks for the reply.

Interesting experience you have with SGs. Please tell me more.
Which brands did you tried out that would hold tenths all day long?
Also which are the "fancier" brands/models you tried that would hold to half-a-tenth?

I've seen some DoAll and Okumato SGs.

Lucky you, less than $700 for a Sanford MG SG, never heard of that brand, but you're able to hold tenths on it is great, I'll put that on my list.

Are these SGs good when bought used and repairable:

• B&S Micromaster
• Mitsui
• Chevalier
• Kent

Thanks for advice.

Most of the grinders I tested were at the local technical college. I started looking in about 2012 for a grinder. As mentioned, I had used the DoAll in our shop, but with the hydraulic tank and drive it was far too large for my shop. I contacted a couple vendors to see what was available. They both mentioned that the local technical college had well over a dozen machines. They also suggested I register and take an evening class to try them out.

All you needed to do to use the machines with minimal supervision was to take a safety exam and demonstrate to the instructor you could properly operate the machines. Over the course of the semester, I was able to use machines built by KO Lee, Acer, Brown & Sharpe, Chevalier, Harig, Kent, and Norton. There were several models of the Kent and Chevalier machines. The nicest were the Chevaliers. They are made in Taiwan, but they were they were also the newest and most automated in the shop.

After the class my search continued. I tested the Sanford, a few Brown & Sharpe machines, and a couple Okamoto's at different commercial shops and equipment vendors. As mmcmdl mentioned achieving a .0001" tolerance takes time and patience. The wheel has to be dressed multiple times. With a manual machine it's a long and boring process, but it can be done.

I ended up with the Sanford mostly because of the footprint, the condition, and the price. It came from a shop that was doing contract work for Mercury Marine in Oshkosh Wisconsin. The owner wanted to retire, but the company kept asking him to continue doing work for them. He finally came to the conclusion that the only way he could refuse their requests was to sell off some of the machinery. In this case he made me an offer I couldn't refuse.

Here are a couple pictures of the machine I purchased. This is exactly how it looked when I brought it home.

 

[Eddyde]

Yes, I am a beginner, but have been reading and watching on the subject for years religiously.
Now it's time to stop reading and watching, get my hand dirty with water soluble cutting fluid and machining oil.

It is great to hear you are so enthusiastic about getting into machining! It's the greatest profession or hobby for the mechanically minded individual.
IMHO, you might want to slow it down a bit. There is a lot to learn and a lot of additional tooling, supplies and infrastructure needed to set up a machine shop. I've been into this for 40 years and there's still a lot more to learn about it than I already know. I suggest getting a lathe and perhaps a mill first and become proficient on them before adding in machines like surface grinders. FTR, I have a SG It's nice to have but honestly, I hardly ever use it.
Of course your needs might be different and you might have specific things you want to make that require a SG? If so I'd still consider learning the basic machines first.

 

[projectnut]

I would agree with Eddyde that if you're just getting into the hobby a surface grinder should be low on the list of things to purchase. While they do come in handy from time to time, they are one of the lesser used machines in the shop. Over the years I've found it's far more cost effective to invest in higher use machines. The 3 most used machines in almost any shop are the horizontal bandsaw, vertical mill, and lathe. Next in line are the belt sanders, grinders, and drill presses. Further down on the list are the contour bandsaws, horizontal milling machines, and drill sharpeners. The lowest on the list are the shapers, surface grinders, and power hacksaws.

I purchased a surface grinder when I had a number of close tolerance jobs that couldn't be done on anything other than a grinder. I considered sending them out to a specialty shop, but the cost to have the job done was more than the cost of the grinder. I've used the machine sevral times since then, but it's still one of the least used machines in the shop.

Often times depending on the size of work you do, and the depth of your pocketbook, a power hacksaw or cold saw can replace the horizontal bandsaw. Keep in mind tooling for the mill and lathe will most likely be at least as expensive as the machines themselves. Often times the cost of tooling is more than the initial cost of the machines. I always keep my eyes open for machines on my "wish" list. If one happens to become available at the right price in good condition, I will certainly take a look at it. However, I won't pay a premium price for a machine that will see limited use.

As time goes on the "wish list" gets shorter, but the machines get larger. Like most shops space becomes more and more limited. Currently the wish list includes a radial drill and a jig bore machine. The likelihood of finding either in the price range and condition I would like is minimal at best.

I'd like to find a radial drill like this. As you can see it won't easily fit in a tight space. It takes up about 22 sq ft of floor space and weighs 18,000 lbs.

5'15" AMERICAN RADIAL DRILL w/36" DIAMETER WORK TABLE - #30180 | eBay

Power Rapid Traverse To Head. Power Column Clamping. Face of Column to Spindle, Minimum 14". Motor, Horsepower 15 HP. Vertical Arm Travel on Column 39.5". Drills to Center of Circle on Base 120". (4) Tapping Leads, Range 8 to 18 TPI.

www.ebay.com

The jig bore is close to the same size, but weighs in at only 4,700 lbs.

Moore Model 3 Jig Borer Boring Press Machine DRO 208/230V 3Ph | eBay

Country of Manufacture: United States. Very nice machine, operates as it should. Unless otherwise specifically agreed to in writing by. Prefer to pick it up yourself?. Model: Model 3. Rpm Gauge does not work.

www.ebay.com

While these machines would be "nice to have" to me they're in almost the same category as the surface grinder. They would be used from time to time, but hardly enough to justify the cost and space they would take up.

 

[Unix]

Wouldn't believe this, seller told me he would give it to me for free, he really needs the space.

I appreciated his reply and asked if I could test it out because it will cost me money to transport it (about 9Hr round trip journey).
He said it can not be powered on because all of his machines are using the power lines.

What should I do in not able to test a machine, specially an SG, not go for it?

Thanks.

 

[projectnut]

Don’t look a gift horse in the mouth. You can rent a drop deck trailer or a low bed UHaul for around $50.00 a day. I’d be more than willing to risk that amount for a potentially great tool.

Take him up on the offer, get the trailer, and go pick it up.

 

[Choiliefan]

Indeed, get the trailer and pick it up.
I bet its still a good machine and if not, you have a fine electromagnetic chuck and that brass Lunkenheimer oiler left of the lower column in your pic.
Don't hesitate, chop chop.