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Seneca Falls Star #30 lathe Resto-Mod

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derf

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#1
One of my buddies, and beginner machinist acquired this Seneca Falls lathe back in Sept. He was like a kid at christmas time with all the excitement of owning his first lathe. Despite the fact that it has to be 100 yrs old and in bad need of some TLC, the machine is truly very sound as far as wear. As you can see, at one time it must have been in the hills of Appalachia, where the custom drive train conversion was installed. It consisted of a Borg-Warner T-86 3 speed truck transmission, driven with a lawn sprinkler motor.
senacafallslathe.jpg

I encouraged him to buy it, for a starter machine and then realized that most of the work that it needed was past his skill level and pay grade. So I stepped up to be a mentor and took on the job of rebuilding this machine, while he helped and learned in the process. I must say, this has been fun and exciting for me as well, and I learned a few more skills. This project came to fruition last week, so I will tell the story from the time we removed the first nuts and bolts.
senecafall2.jpg
Once we removed the redneck racing speed selector, we got a better overall view of what had to be done.
There is nothing wrong with a flat belt drive, but it would help if we woulda had the other cone pulley. Finding one of these that was compatible would be like finding unicorn tears. I came up with the idea to make a cone pulley from hardwood. I started with a sleeve to slide on to a keyed shaft, then epoxied the pulleys to the sleeve.
senecafall2.jpg pulleysleeve.jpg pulleysleeve.jpg pulleysleeve.jpg step pulley.jpg
With that done, it gave me a better idea how to position the rest of the drive train and motor mounts.
motormt.jpg
I used some existing holes in the bed for the anchor plate. mb.jpg
Once the anchor was in place, the rest of the brackets could be positioned and tacked up.
The motor/pullet bracket pivots on a 1/2" shaft, and the belt tensioner is operated with a 3/4" shaft with a simple over -center type extender with an adjustable link.
belttensioner.jpg
belttensioner2.jpg
This creates about 1" of slack to change the belt over to a different pulley.
 

derf

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#2
One of my buddies, and beginner machinist acquired this Seneca Falls lathe back in Sept. He was like a kid at christmas time with all the excitement of owning his first lathe. Despite the fact that it has to be 100 yrs old and in bad need of some TLC, the machine is truly very sound as far as wear. As you can see, at one time it must have been in the hills of Appalachia, where the custom drive train conversion was installed. It consisted of a Borg-Warner T-86 3 speed truck transmission, driven with a lawn sprinkler motor.
View attachment 263435

I encouraged him to buy it, for a starter machine and then realized that most of the work that it needed was past his skill level and pay grade. So I stepped up to be a mentor and took on the job of rebuilding this machine, while he helped and learned in the process. I must say, this has been fun and exciting for me as well, and I learned a few more skills. This project came to fruition last week, so I will tell the story from the time we removed the first nuts and bolts.
View attachment 263440
Once we removed the redneck racing speed selector, we got a better overall view of what had to be done.
There is nothing wrong with a flat belt drive, but it would help if we woulda had the other cone pulley. Finding one of these that was compatible would be like finding unicorn tears. I came up with the idea to make a cone pulley from hardwood. I started with a sleeve to slide on to a keyed shaft, then epoxied the pulleys to the sleeve.
View attachment 263440 View attachment 263441 View attachment 263441 View attachment 263441 View attachment 263442
With that done, it gave me a better idea how to position the rest of the drive train and motor mounts.
View attachment 263443
I used some existing holes in the bed for the anchor plate. View attachment 263444
Once the anchor was in place, the rest of the brackets could be positioned and tacked up.
The motor/pullet bracket pivots on a 1/2" shaft, and the belt tensioner is operated with a 3/4" shaft with a simple over -center type extender with an adjustable link.
View attachment 263445
View attachment 263446
This creates about 1" of slack to change the belt over to a different pulley.
 

FOMOGO

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#3
Very clever idea with the wood pulleys, and nicely executed. Cheers, Mike
 

brino

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#4
@derf,

It's great that you got the original legs with the lathe.
What size (hp) motor did you mount?
For some perspective, what size is that chuck?

Thanks for sharing this, I am "Watching" this thread!

-brino
 

benmychree

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#5
Very nice job! I once made a cone pulley in that fashion for a speed lathe; there is a diagrammatic method for determining the sizes of the steps where it is all laid out full size and a straightedge used to project from one pulley to the to - be - determined pulley to be created; this assures that the belt will have equal tension on all the steps, even if one of the pulleys has larger diameter steps than the other, as the older Hendey lathes do. I found this method in one of the older machinist's handbooks, likely American Machinist's Handbook or an older Machinery's Handbook.
 

chips&more

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#6
Looks good! I had a Seneca Falls lathe about 50 years ago? The one thing that stands out and I will tell you is: Check the head stock babbitt bearings. AND check the end shake and then check it again. Mine had some kind of fiber washer on the end of the rear bearing. Maybe try making a Delrin washer? I still have the taper attachment from it somewhere in the shop???...Dave
 

derf

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#7
When I made the pulleys, I just duplicated the sizes on the spindle. The motor we used was a "donation" from a mutual friend of ours, and is a 1 hp Harbor Freight.
This headstock does not have babbit bearings....it's just cast iron. It has ring oilers that picks up oil and rolls it to the top of the spindle journal, and as it disperses it eventually ends up back into the reservoir.
The chuck is a 6" version that will be replaced in the future. The lathe is a 12" swing with a 5 ft bed. There seems to be little information about this lathe, as I have seen mentions of #10's and #20's, but nothing on a #30.
 

derf

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#7
I have no idea why there are double posts.....my mouse has been acting very wonky. I just changed it out, so we'll see what happens. Anyway...back to the story.

Once we got the motor set up, it was time to see if it would run. The leather belt that was on it, was actually sew together on the machine. The previous owner told that he had a saddle maker do that, and it was evident because the belt was made from saddle leather.

It ran, but it had that slap from the splice in the belt, and it would not quit stretching. I knew at that point it was gonna get a rubber belt. To get a continuous belt to work, the spindle and the back gear would have to be removed, which I was not crazy about. As I told my buddy, let's do this right, and do it once. If we have to go this far, we're already committed.
So I started on tearing the headstock down, the spindle was no problem, but the back gear was a little more difficult. The way it looked, it was a one shot deal from the factory because the only way it was coming out was to extract the cam from the inboard side side. To do this, I had to make a puller and drill and tap two 10-32 holes in the cam itself to pull it to the outside. The woodruff key prevented the shaft from simply being pushed out.
All the bearing surfaces looked good, which I thought was amazing for such an old machine.
DSC02409.JPG
Of course the casting was rough after the 47 coats of paint and pre-Civil War crud was removed. I spent numerous hours grinding and sanding most of the scale and bumps off, and what didn't clean up got filled with bondo. A nice smooth surface cleans much easier than a rough casting, so at this point I was committed to slick up the whole top side. The saddle, apron , cross slide, tailstock and compound got the same treatment. The apron was rough enough that I decided that milling it was easier that trying to grind out unsightly blemishes.
DSC02419.JPG
Same deal on the cross slide.
DSC02417.JPG
It took a little more work on the saddle.
DSC02427.JPG
I couldn't get that detailed on the tail stock, but I got the bottom squared up.
DSC02431.JPG
I took a leveling cut on the top just to have a nice level surface to place a magnetic base for an indicator. Once all serious machining was done, I went back to the cosmetic sanding and grinding. I then spent 3 hrs cleaning up all that nasty cast iron dust from me and the machines...
 

derf

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#8
While I had the apron down, I decided a slight mod was needed to locate the position of the leadscrew/feed selector. Originally equipped with a knurled knob, it was hard to determined where the positions actually were, other than feel. I fashioned an indicator arm from 1/16" flat stock that pivots on a screw and extends out to point at the proper position.
DSC02422.JPG
Once I figured out where the true positions were, I milled in some primitive hieroglyphics to show what should be happening.
DSC02421.JPG
In case you need a translation, the horizontal line means longitudinal feed, the zig zag line means threading, the vertical line, cross feeding. ;)
 

derf

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#9
When we first got this machine moved into some good light and give it a good once over, I noticed some peculiarities that needed to be addressed. The first thing being the oddball taper in the tailstock quill. It was not quite right to be a #2 morse because the big end seated before the small end and left some wiggle. The small end of the socket was bigger than a #2, and to clean it up for a #2 was out of the question, so I bored it to a #3 on my lathe then finished up with a # 3 morse reamer. While I was at it, I set it up in the mill and cut graduations on the quill for quick reference.
DSC02412.JPG
It didn't come with a dial on the crank end like most lathes of the era, so while I was on a dial binge, I made one for it. The original retainer nut had to be turned down so a hollowed out dial would fit, and it is large enough to read fairly easy.
DSC02472.JPG
Another thing missing was a graduated dial on the compound. After I pulled the screw, it was found to be a 14 tpi, which comes out to .0714285" per revolution. So when I made the dial, I just made 72 lines and called it close enough.
DSC02411.JPG
Although it was optional at the time, there was no thread dial, or a provision for mounting one. Once I figured out the gear size, I made the unit using a couple of 1" pipe caps for the flares top and bottom, and a scrap piece of barrel for the middle and brazed them together. I added the angle iron bracket and tipped it slightly so the gear meshed with the leadscrew helix.
threaddial.jpg DSC02406.JPG
It was cramped fit around the half nut lever, so a knob was added to the lever to better access.
DSC02473.JPG
 

FOMOGO

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#10
Some very nice work there. Makes me want to get to work on my old Sebastion, which is of similar vintage. Looking forward to seeing yours all gussied up. Mike
 

brino

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#11
Beautiful work!
It is great to see a new life given to old machines.
Thanks for sharing this.
-brino
 

derf

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#12
Now that most of the major dilemmas were conquered, it was time to pick the dried rotten meat from this old dinosaur's bones. The bed and legs still had remains of japanning and gilsonite in places that were hard to get to. The easier stripping was done by previous owners and then covered by the nauseating pea green paint. Starting out with oven cleaner to knock the lion share off, then down to primitive weapons like wire brushes and wheels and in some spots, picks and shovels. A good blast with a pressure washer got it to 90% clean.
DSC02429.JPG
I couldn't get anything this big in my blast cabinet, the rest was all wiped down by hand. I must say, the fillers they used 100 yrs ago were still hard as concrete, and if it weren't for the fact that in some places it was applied sloppy and unsightly, I would have left in on.
front.jpg
A little elbow grease and it came out good. The inside not so much. I decided to paint the inside of the bed with red rustoleum and even after 3 coats the gilsonite still bled through a little.
bed.jpg
I did get very lucky when it came to removing the legs. It just so happens that my rolling work bench would slide right under and between the legs of the lathe, with 1/2" to spare.
Once in position, I slid a couple of wood wedges between the bed and the bench to take the weight off the legs so I could unbolt them. When we got down to just the bed, it was easy to handle on the bench top. Oh, did I mention that every fastener on this thing has a square head? Most were accessible with a open end wrench, but there were a few that needed a socket....a size that I didn't have. So I had to get creative and modify a chinese socket to remove those, and of course they all got replaced with modern stuff.
Since this was down as basic as it would go, we had a serious discussion about a chip pan.
It was not going to be simple with the full length cast legs because of the flare and the taper. I wanted a pan that didn't have any open spots and looked like it belonged there.
There were factory models that had pans:
index.jpg
As you can see, the pan was sandwiched between the sub bases and the legs, like many other lathes of the era. I really did not want to get into a total new set of legs and risers and etc...so I came up with a simpler plan.
This consisted of fabricating some boxes that resembled a top hat so to speak, that is square rather than cylindrical. The boxes are dropped over the legs, and extend down 5" with a flange on the bottom.
chippan.JPG
The chip pan has 2 square holes cut in and then dropped over the boxes as shown in this inverted pic.
rightsideup.JPG
Upon final assembly, the pan was secured to the boxes with button head machine screws.
base.JPG
 

derf

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#13
As you can see, we're to the point of puttin' some fresh lipstick on this pig, and most of the sub assemblies were painted as there were rebuilt and re-assembled to to keeps all the parts together. We settled on Majic Massey-Ferguson gray tractor enamel, using the gloss hardner and japan drier. It is slightly darker than South Bend gray, but still that "classic machine gray" hue.
When we got to point of having all the components on place, It was time to fab up a back splash, now that it has a fancy chip pan to attach to.
backspash.JPG
The back splash covers the front to form a 12" shelf. The shelf is made from 3/4" plywood salvaged from a cabinet door.
DSC02474.JPG

This machine did not come with a gear box cover, nor a provision for mounting one, and of course it didn't come with all the gears either, so I had to make both. I made the cover slightly different that the factory version, so it had room for an outboard spider. The spider is actually an extended spindle nut I made about 3/4" longer than oem, and d&t for 1/4-20
screws.
DSC02479.JPG
Attached to the guard is a spindle speed chart I engraved on my cnc mill.
DSC02480.JPG
This machine came with 4 gears out of the original 11 that they came with. I knew it was a waste of time looking for missing gears and I would somehow have to make some. It was just a matter of how to attack this situation. The gears were 14 DP, and reasonable costing gear cutters were scarce. After a lot of research, I decided to make the cutter myself. I got the best information about easy gear cutting from this website: http://www.david.rysdam.org/
He tells how to make a single cutter to cut a whole range of teeth. I used a simple spindex on the gears that was divisible, and made indexing plates on my cnc mill for the ones that weren't.
gears.jpg
For ease of machining, I used 6061 aluminum. For ease of set-up, I color coded the gears and made up index cards.
colorcode.jpg
indexcard.jpg
 

brino

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#14
First class all the way.
That lathe is much better now than when it came from the factory!
-brino
 

derf

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#15
Even though the color coded gears and the cheat sheets make it easier to set up for threading, I find it slightly annoying to have to change gears around for general turning. I have 3 lathes with quick change gear boxes, so I might be a bit biased. To get around that monkey motion, the best idea that I've seen in many moons was to power the lead screw with an electric motor. I found enough info here and other places on the net to proceed.
I did give this some fore thought however when I had the machine down to basics. While the lead screw was out of the machine, I drilled and reamed a 1/2" hole in the tail end of the screw, and added a 1/8" crosscut for a way to drive it. The screw was retained by two flat bottom plugs for end play. I removed the plugs and made a threaded bushing that would retain the end play and allow a 1/2" drive rod to protrude out to a motor drive. The 1/2" shaft fits into the screw about 1", and is driven with a 1/8" pin in the crosscut. The crosscut is about .135" deep, so the drive pin is slightly below flush and the bushing controls the end play of the screw with a jamb nut. On the other side of the jamb nut is more threads and a nut to locate a motor mount.
DSC02465.JPG
The mount was made to be dis-engaged when using the spindle powered drive train, so the motor and gear simply swing away from the screw gear.
Basically I used a wiper motor like everyone else had success with, that was rated at 50 rpm on the hi side and 35 rpm on the low. I originally made the gearing 1:1, and it proved to be too slow, so I went with 2:1, with a little concern about torque loss. I actually checked the rpm with a tach and it was 42 rpm on the hi side and 34 on the low. At first I wired it for 2 speed operation and it made absolutely no sense to have 2 speeds when you have a pot to adjust current. So I eliminated a switch and just wired up the hi speed side. For the speed control we used pwm and crammed that and the power supply into a control box that I had left over from an old Bridgeport. I had to made a new cover to accommodate the switches tastefully.
DSC02485.JPG
The power supply is wired through the drum switch so the screw has no power if the spindle is not running. As a safety feature, so the electric powered screw is not conflicting with the spindle powering the screw at the same time, a push button momentary switch was installed below the banjo. The banjo must be swung down, dis-engaging the gear train, then activating the switch.
DSC02484.JPG
By doing this, the only way to get power to the screw is obvious.
In the same circuit, there is also a limit switch. This switch can be set to stop the screw, thus stopping the carriage at any point. It can also be operated by hand, which is handy when the feed clutch is a star knob. I find feed levers more natural and responsive than a knob. So you can depress the button at the end of a cut, and then release the feed clutch knob without the worries of bad timing.
DSC02477.JPG
As I mentioned before, I had some reservations about loss of torque by going 2:1 on the driver motor, so I figured the best way to find out is to turn something. I found an old stainless rifle barrel and chucked it up. I set the spindle speed in 3rd gear (715 rpm) and was using a ccmt insert, took a .015" doc and flipped the switch. I turned it up to full throttle and watched nice little chips fly off with no effort. Then I decided to go from feed, to using the half nut, which is the feed rate x 2.77.
I noticed a small slow down, (at least it sounded that way) but still with the throttle up, it was throwing chips faster than I could get away from them! From my best guess, it was about .025" per rev. Needless to say...I was impressed. Now that I know it works well, I dressed it up with a gear cover.
DSC02478.JPG
 

FOMOGO

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#16
That has come out great. You do nice work my friend. Mike
 

derf

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#17
Everyone seems to think that the unexplained hole on the tail stock is for a grease dauber, but I found a better use.
DSC02475.JPG
DSC02476.JPG
It makes a nice anchor point to attach a little tag-a-long tray to hold chuck keys, center drills or even a mic, and it easily lifts off.
 

derf

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#18
I discovered that I had a coupla steel drawers that were covered in dust under one of my work benches. These came off a cheap roller tool cart, but they did have have nice slides.
Although they don't match, they will do the job, so I mounted them under the chip tray.
DSC02497.JPG
I had mentioned before, that the chuck would be replaced. I wasn't in no hurry, but a chuck solution was needed, whether it was now, or down the road. The thread on the spindle is 1-9/16" x10 tpi....not common by any means. I tore the original 3 jaw down just to find the normal wear for a 100 yr. old chuck...kinda sloppy. So I cleaned it up and took a dusting off cut to reveal some fresh metal.
DSC02499.JPG
I had never seen a chuck that had square head adjusters, but the bad thing is that they protrude outside the periphery of the chuck body about 3/16"....not something I feel safe about.
I'm actually glad that I made a clean up cut on the outside surfaces, because under all that patina, here's what I found:
DSC02500.JPG
Every one of the T slots had at least one crack, some had 2. I guess we're chuck shopping now.
 

brino

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#19
that chuck could still be useful for a low-speed, non-precision purpose like a welding rotary positioner.
-brino
 

derf

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#20
No doubt that chuck will be re-purposed for something, if nothing else a door stop.
All of the 6" chucks that I looked at had a mounting bolt hole pattern of 5.591", and the current back plate is only 5.620" in dia. This presents a dilemma, as I really do not want to have to turn and thread a raw casting. I did find one back plate for 1"-8 tpi, that I could just open up and re-thread for 1-9/16"-10 spindle, but I'd rather not go through the process of first making a spindle replication for a means of checking the threads.
After a few cups of coffee and much thought, it was then when I discovered an un-used chuck underneath my Jet lathe. I had totally forgot about this, as it was the original 3 jaw that came with my 1340, but I never mounted it because I installed a Bison 6 jaw adjust tru on that lathe right off the bat. This particular chuck has a D1-4 mount, so I tore the back off and realized that the studs screw into the back half of the chuck, not on a separate back.
After a gander at the insides, I realized that there was enough meat to remove the studs, and counter bore the back to inset the existing back plate.
I have turned many back plates, but I have never actually turned the back of a chuck. I figured the best way to accomplish this is by clamping the chuck itself to a trued bar between centers. The chuck has an 1-1/2" through hole, so I used an 1" round bar to clamp it to. This gave ample room to counterbore to 4.625" dia. and .250" deep.
I then turned the back plate to a snug fit, and proceeded to the mill and drilled and tapped 3 places 3/8-16 and countersunk the back plate for flat head screws.
Once I had it together, I mounted it on the spindle and checked for runout. I musta done something right....it was right on par with what one would expect from a 3 jaw chuck.
DSC02498.JPG
Sure , it's chinese, but what isn't nowadays. I tried to decipher the chinese chicken scratchin' and came up with 2 possible translations: #1. "manufactured by Lon Ding Dong, toolmaker to the royal emperor", or #2. "soy sauce"......:grin:
 

derf

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#21
After lots of hours of dirty but enjoyable work, I can say this project is pretty much done. Unless the owner comes up with a DRO to install, this lathe is ready to make some serious chips. I'm ready to christen this ole' gal with a magnum of cutting oil and let the chips fly!
DSC02486.JPG
DSC02488.JPG
DSC02489.JPG
DSC02490.JPG
DSC02491.JPG
DSC02492.JPG
DSC02493.JPG
DSC02494.JPG
DSC02496.JPG
Thanks for watching and all the kind comments.
 

the1911dude

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#22
Hello everyone, I believe this is my first post. I am the owner of this fabulous machine and I am in complete awe of how it turned out. I never thought it would turned out so well. Anyhow this was an amazing project and I was able to contribute a bit here and there. I made a couple of the knobs and some other small parts using another lathe, nothing as impressive as the rest of the work, but it brings a smile to my face when I look at them small projects. I got to create some chips on this lathe as well and I absolutely love the powe lead screw. There is a lot of other work that went into this build, but for the most part it’s all accurately and amazing well covered in this thread. I can’t say thank you enough as I feel I have a truly awesome machine. I have some beginner projects in mind, and I have no doubt that this machine is well able to complete them and as I grow in experience I am sure this machine is far able to do functions beyond my capabilities. Hopefully you enjoyed this thread as I have enjoyed being involved in this build.
 

the1911dude

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#23
When we first got this machine moved into some good light and give it a good once over, I noticed some peculiarities that needed to be addressed. The first thing being the oddball taper in the tailstock quill. It was not quite right to be a #2 morse because the big end seated before the small end and left some wiggle. The small end of the socket was bigger than a #2, and to clean it up for a #2 was out of the question, so I bored it to a #3 on my lathe then finished up with a # 3 morse reamer. While I was at it, I set it up in the mill and cut graduations on the quill for quick reference.
View attachment 263590
It didn't come with a dial on the crank end like most lathes of the era, so while I was on a dial binge, I made one for it. The original retainer nut had to be turned down so a hollowed out dial would fit, and it is large enough to read fairly easy.
View attachment 263593
Another thing missing was a graduated dial on the compound. After I pulled the screw, it was found to be a 14 tpi, which comes out to .0714285" per revolution. So when I made the dial, I just made 72 lines and called it close enough.
View attachment 263591
Although it was optional at the time, there was no thread dial, or a provision for mounting one. Once I figured out the gear size, I made the unit using a couple of 1" pipe caps for the flares top and bottom, and a scrap piece of barrel for the middle and brazed them together. I added the angle iron bracket and tipped it slightly so the gear meshed with the leadscrew helix.
View attachment 263594 View attachment 263595
It was cramped fit around the half nut lever, so a knob was added to the lever to better access.
View attachment 263596
Looks good! I had a Seneca Falls lathe about 50 years ago? The one thing that stands out and I will tell you is: Check the head stock babbitt bearings. AND check the end shake and then check it again. Mine had some kind of fiber washer on the end of the rear bearing. Maybe try making a Delrin washer? I still have the taper attachment from it somewhere in the shop???...Dave
I might be interested in that taper attachment for this lathe, if you find it please let me know.
 

tweinke

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#24
Wow awesome machine, you will have memories of that build for a long time
 

coffmajt

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Sep 25, 2013
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183
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163
#25
Great job of restoring and documenting all the little things that make an older machine even more useable. I know the new owner will be proud of all the work that went into this build. Thanks for sharing -- Jack
 

the1911dude

Swarf
Registered Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2017
Messages
5
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16
#26
300A63E8-52C9-4B66-8880-AD8655400681.jpeg
300A63E8-52C9-4B66-8880-AD8655400681.jpeg Here is a picture of my first chips as I blanked out a gear for final cutting operation.
 

dtsh

H-M Supporter - Sustaining Member
H-M Supporter - Sustaining Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2017
Messages
90
Likes
102
#27
Wow, I sure wish my Seneca Falls lathe looked *half* that nice!
 

ACHiPo

H-M Supporter - Premium Member
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2017
Messages
603
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498
#29
Even though the color coded gears and the cheat sheets make it easier to set up for threading, I find it slightly annoying to have to change gears around for general turning. I have 3 lathes with quick change gear boxes, so I might be a bit biased. To get around that monkey motion, the best idea that I've seen in many moons was to power the lead screw with an electric motor. I found enough info here and other places on the net to proceed.
I did give this some fore thought however when I had the machine down to basics. While the lead screw was out of the machine, I drilled and reamed a 1/2" hole in the tail end of the screw, and added a 1/8" crosscut for a way to drive it. The screw was retained by two flat bottom plugs for end play. I removed the plugs and made a threaded bushing that would retain the end play and allow a 1/2" drive rod to protrude out to a motor drive. The 1/2" shaft fits into the screw about 1", and is driven with a 1/8" pin in the crosscut. The crosscut is about .135" deep, so the drive pin is slightly below flush and the bushing controls the end play of the screw with a jamb nut. On the other side of the jamb nut is more threads and a nut to locate a motor mount.
View attachment 263912
The mount was made to be dis-engaged when using the spindle powered drive train, so the motor and gear simply swing away from the screw gear.
Basically I used a wiper motor like everyone else had success with, that was rated at 50 rpm on the hi side and 35 rpm on the low. I originally made the gearing 1:1, and it proved to be too slow, so I went with 2:1, with a little concern about torque loss. I actually checked the rpm with a tach and it was 42 rpm on the hi side and 34 on the low. At first I wired it for 2 speed operation and it made absolutely no sense to have 2 speeds when you have a pot to adjust current. So I eliminated a switch and just wired up the hi speed side. For the speed control we used pwm and crammed that and the power supply into a control box that I had left over from an old Bridgeport. I had to made a new cover to accommodate the switches tastefully.
View attachment 263913
The power supply is wired through the drum switch so the screw has no power if the spindle is not running. As a safety feature, so the electric powered screw is not conflicting with the spindle powering the screw at the same time, a push button momentary switch was installed below the banjo. The banjo must be swung down, dis-engaging the gear train, then activating the switch.
View attachment 263914
By doing this, the only way to get power to the screw is obvious.
In the same circuit, there is also a limit switch. This switch can be set to stop the screw, thus stopping the carriage at any point. It can also be operated by hand, which is handy when the feed clutch is a star knob. I find feed levers more natural and responsive than a knob. So you can depress the button at the end of a cut, and then release the feed clutch knob without the worries of bad timing.
View attachment 263915
As I mentioned before, I had some reservations about loss of torque by going 2:1 on the driver motor, so I figured the best way to find out is to turn something. I found an old stainless rifle barrel and chucked it up. I set the spindle speed in 3rd gear (715 rpm) and was using a ccmt insert, took a .015" doc and flipped the switch. I turned it up to full throttle and watched nice little chips fly off with no effort. Then I decided to go from feed, to using the half nut, which is the feed rate x 2.77.
I noticed a small slow down, (at least it sounded that way) but still with the throttle up, it was throwing chips faster than I could get away from them! From my best guess, it was about .025" per rev. Needless to say...I was impressed. Now that I know it works well, I dressed it up with a gear cover.
View attachment 263916
Great project! How is the spindle drive synchronized to the chuck for threading?
 

derf

Active Member
Active Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2015
Messages
530
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581
#30
With the color coded gears.
 
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