Is an old domestic lathe worth the same as a new import lathe?

Not to mention some times you don't even need new gears, you just need to arrange the ones you already have in a different orders. If you have 4 to 6 gears in the train, and a decent number of gears on hand, you mathematically have hundreds of thousands of combinations.

When I first got my little 8x14 I wrote an application the calculated all the combinations. I quickly found I could theoretically thread any pitch with a lead accuracy better than any ground ball screw you could buy.
 
Unless the lathe was supposed to come with an external set of change gears but didn't.
 
I think which way you go depends on how much you know. It takes a lot more know-how to both buy and refurbish old American iron. I had an old $500.oo 11 inch Logan for 30 years and made lots of stuff on it. The down side was I considered it a miracle to produce work within .005 just by turning. The finish was so bad I could hardly measure it. I finally sold it (for what I paid for it) and got a Grizzly G4003G gunsmith lathe. Now I get a nice finish and can work to .001 standing on my head.
 
It depends on the specific lathe, condition, price range, and skill/experience of the buyer/owner. It also depends on what you plan to do with it and tolerance needed.
The availability of older lathes in preserved condition is low. The availability of new lathes is high.
 
The OP asks about old American vs. new imports. I’d throw old imports into the mix as well. I am very pleased with my Takisawa TSL-800, a Japanese designed, Taiwan produced lathe from 1976. It’s a 14” 2500 pound lathe, 3 HP, all the features and gears necessary. I got it from a machine shop closing, the owner bought it new. The design is typicall Japanese, very close attention given to moving and rotating parts. It’s impressively smooth and solid.
 
There is NO way anyone should recommend buying an old machine to a new hobbyist. I've been on this hobby for over a year and there's not a chance I'd buy an old machine. Maybe after 15 years, I'd be comfortable enough to get one.
 
There's really no right answer for this since so much depends on your budget, abilities and the condition of any particular used machine.

I bought my Seneca Falls Star lathe for $300 and used it mainly for cleaning up racing go-kart engine parts for the first few years I had it. It replaced a Chinese 3 in 1 that didn't do anything well, or so I thought. Looking back, if I had been more patient and willing to learn I probably could have made the 3 in 1 do decent work but I didn't have anybody to teach me and I only saw the flaws in that machine. To be clear, I still wouldn't recommend one of those machines to a beginner but it might not have been as bad as I thought.

This past year I've put a lot of effort into my Seneca Falls machine and It does pretty much what I need it to do. I learned about grinding HSS bits and when to use indexable carbides, I put an AXA qctp on and replaced the old out of balance motor with a new 3-phase and a VFD. I bought a set of collets and finally got the backing plate tapped out for the 4-jaw chuck I bought years ago. In short I spent the time to learn what my machine could do and how to use it.

Now, would I rather have a nice new Taiwanese lathe (or even better a good used heavy duty machine like a Takisawa)? Why yes, yes I would. But even with everything I've put into my Star I'm probably $2k away from any of the machines I would buy if I had the money. So, if someone has three or four grand to drop on a lathe you can either get a good used machine or a decent import. If going used you better bring someone experienced with you to check it out before spending that much, but there are probably good machines out there in that price range. Buying new gets you support and a warranty but you will still have to put the time in before you'll get good results.

I would say it's kinda like buying a guitar, trying to learn on something that's no good will be frustrating regardless if it's new or used. However, you could get a brand new import of dubious quality, or the finest vintage Stratocaster available but neither will make you into Eric Clapton. Putting in the work is the only way to get the results you desire.

Cheers,

John
 
I have to add that condition of the lathe is everything - new or used. I bought a taiwanese produced 12X36 lathe in 1983 or so brand new, and it worked great - for a while. but the seals died, and it has been a pain to add oil to the bearings. So only a complete rehab will make this lathe a joy to use. The same is true for many of the lower cost offshore machines - the new ones that is.

I purchased a 14X40 chinese lathe, used last year. I found so many hidden problems brought on by previous owners that I am discouraged by it. It will be a great lathe when I'm done with it, but the effort wasn't really worth it. So I am selling it after restoration. I'm not a newbie. I still got less than I expected and paid more than I should have. (I'm 200 hours in to it now and about 50 more to go).

I just acquired a LeBlond 15X60 7.5 HP lathe that was made in 1980. Why? -- because it has been so well cared for that it is in better than showroom condition. As I said condition is everything. It was also less money than the 14X40 I bought last year. More capable, More accurate. Old US Iron. But carefully selected and found after 20 years of looking for my perfect lathe.

Moral of the story: If you buy used, take an experienced guy for a second opinion and expertise about condition of the lathe. If you buy new, ditto. NEVER buy a lathe unseen (sorry vendors). Take the time to go to the vendor and carefully examine the machine you want to buy. It should impress you at every turn. If you can't afford a lathe that is good quality, then expect poor capabilities, or save more and buy better.

We have a vendor here that unboxes your lathe and checks it out by a qualified millwright and puts it on the floor. You buy it off the floor and you can see everything - they will even power it up for you at request (and serious buying intent - not tire kicking) You pay about 1000$ more there, but they deliver it to the exact spot, set it up and it is leveled and ready for use. That's how to buy a new lathe for a beginner. Worth the extra savings. They support your purchase long after they have to. They sell used lathes the same way...
 
There is no answer to this question other than it depends. I would wager that the virtually all of the guys like me with absolutely no machining experience other than maybe a high school shop class taken decades ago that want to get into machining for whatever reason have no one they know with sufficient experience to drag along with them to look at a lathe. I didn't. And how often would that person be willing to go on wild goose chases looking for the perfect lathe.

Everyone has a budget that dictates what they can afford. If that budget allows for a brand new lathe. Fine. But if that budget barely allows for a small older lathe are we to tell that person sorry but you can't be a part of this hobby. Go do something else. I don't think so. IMHO the best advice that can be given is to try to buy the best machine that they can afford that suits their needs.

I spent most of my life racing sailboats off So CAL and down into Mexico. Whenever anyone would ask my friends and I what they should buy our first question was always have they made a statement of requirements of what they wanted in a boat and how they intended to use. Commonly referred to as a SOR. Only then could we give any meaningful suggestions on boats that might meet their SOR. The same holds true in machining as a hobby. The newbie needs to think about what they want to make. What they want to use their lathe for. The newbie also needs to be honest with their capabilities. Are they a "Macgyver" or can they barely change a light bulb. All this and more should be included in a SOR. Someone who wants to make clocks has very different needs compared to someone who wants to do gunsmithing. Or who wants to make steam engines.

When this questions comes up we should focus first what they want to make and then on their budget. Then offer suggestions on lathes that would meet their needs and places to look for decent equipment.
 
Old thread with an on-going question . In the terms of lathes only , I prefer older iron . Growing up on Hardinges , Cohlchesters , Pacemakers , Regals etc , the newer imports feel lightweight IMO . I owned a brand new ShopFox lathe a while back that I sold because it just never felt right to me . Perhaps this doesn't make sense to some on here , but I'm not a hobby machinist by trade . The lathe held tight tolerances and I'm sure it would have sufficed for gunsmithing duties , but I would still prefer an older Clausing . Just my opinion . It isn't the machine making the parts , it's the operator standing in front of the lathe . I currently have an old Clausing 12" that will most likely be my keeper and an Atlas 12" to go .

As far as mills , I haven't owned or operated a mini-mill so I can't comment . I've owned Bridgeports , Laguns , Encos , Sharps etc . They are all nice if properly maintained . I run an Enco in at work which has the 2 speed motor . Nice feature .

It comes down to what you prefer , budget , parts being made etc . Only the purchaser can make that decision .
 
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