• This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn more.
  • PLEASE SUPPORT OUR FORUM - UPGRADE YOUR ACCOUNT HERE!
[4]

Shars 5" ER40 Zero Set Fine Adjustment Collet Chuck

January Project of the Month [3]
[10] Like what you see?
Click here to donate to this forum and upgrade your account!

mksj

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2014
Messages
1,732
Likes
2,080
#1
Wish this was around previously so I wouldn't have had to make my own set-true ER40. This is the first I have seen of a Set True or Set Fine adjustment style ER40 chuck from a manufacturer, and at a reasonable price. Should be easily to use different style back plates. Also see they now offer ER bearing nuts, although do not know the quality. FYI.
http://www.shars.com/5-er40-zero-set-fine-adjustment-collet-chuck
http://www.shars.com/er-40-ball-bearing-collet-nut
202-1029diagram.jpg
Works best on light cutting operation with easy to cut material such as aluminum or alloy steel
4 Fine adjustment screws on the side can be used to true up the chuck within 0.00005“ TIR repeatability
Collet chuck body is made from forged steel and precision machined
Compatible with standard ER40 collet which has a range of 1/8" to 1"
Max 6,000 rpm
Comes with 3 mounting bolts M8 x 70mm
Offer in plain back mounting with various threads size back plate or D series direct camlock mounting
 

ddickey

H-M Supporter - Premium Member
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2016
Messages
1,456
Likes
743
#2
Not sure if alloy steel belongs in the same sentence with aluminum.
 

Alan H

H-M Supporter - Premium Member
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Oct 10, 2016
Messages
904
Likes
909
#3
Thanks for the tip Mark. I need one of those. Need to look for a backplate now.
 

ttabbal

Active Member
Active Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2017
Messages
397
Likes
398
#4
I saw those, but couldn't find any reviews for them. I'm interested in picking up an ER40 collet chuck for D1-4 in the future and found these interesting. If I can really adjust the runout that well, it might be worth the extra cost for these and some nicer collets.
 

pstemari

H-M Supporter - Premium Member
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
May 18, 2015
Messages
280
Likes
308
#5
Your D1-4 probably has a MT5 in the bore—lots of ER chucks will fit that directly, which should have less runout.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
 

ttabbal

Active Member
Active Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2017
Messages
397
Likes
398
#6
Your D1-4 probably has a MT5 in the bore—lots of ER chucks will fit that directly, which should have less runout.
It does. The only reason I've considered not going that route was to keep the through-bore accessible for longer stock.
 

mksj

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2014
Messages
1,732
Likes
2,080
#7
With a set-tru chuck you can dial the TIR down to nil., the standard D1-4 ER40 chuck direct mounts (which I previously ordered and returned) often had issues of bad TIR and also axial skew. A few issues with the MT5 to ER40 adapter, it requires a 3/4" or 20mm drawbar which further compromises the through hole capacity and limits the usefulness of the chuck in this application. The better MT5 to ER40 adapter are expensive, the cheaper ones are about the same price as this Shars chuck and the adapter spec. for runout is 0.010-0.015mm (0.0004-0.0006") which is worse than the Shar's. Your machine spindle is unprotected from grit and swarf.
 

mikey

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2012
Messages
3,869
Likes
4,096
#8
Offer in plain back mounting with various threads size back plate or D series direct camlock mounting.
Looks really good, Mark. I wonder if they mean that it is available already mounted to a D1 back plate.
 

jbolt

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2013
Messages
1,330
Likes
1,185
#9
Gotta love Shars. On their Ebay store the shipping for the chuck is $51. Through the website it is $31. Price of the chuck is the same.
 

middle.road

Actively Learning...
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Apr 28, 2014
Messages
1,295
Likes
665
#10
That sucker would fit in a medium flat rate.....
Shar's shipping has gone wonky since November.
Ordered (4) AXA holders then and it took over a week for FedEX SuperSaver to get here. And they charged $12 for shipping.
I'm looking for (8) or so BXA's now and the shipping charges came in at over $42.
I sent them a message and just received this back:

Code:
In order to get combined shipping, all items must be added to your cart. 
You do have to commit to buy, however you do not need to pay. 
If you are not happy with the shipping, we can simply cancel the order

Regards
That's all fine and good but I doubt that is how eBay will see it...
 

Bob Korves

H-M Supporter - Sustaining Member
H-M Supporter - Sustaining Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2014
Messages
4,984
Likes
5,329
#11
Gotta love Shars. On their Ebay store the shipping for the chuck is $51. Through the website it is $31. Price of the chuck is the same.
Sure. That is to pay for the cut that eBay takes off the top and the additional hassles. Work it the other way. Find All Industrial's deal and part number for the tool holders on eBay. Then call them and give them the part number and ask for their best price delivered to wherever you are. Ask them to make it good because eBay will not get a cut. I did that, got an incredible price, much lower than anybody else would go, They showed up the next day. Sellers are very happy to cut eBay out of a sure deal.
 

jbolt

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2013
Messages
1,330
Likes
1,185
#12
Sure. That is to pay for the cut that eBay takes off the top and the additional hassles. Work it the other way. Find All Industrial's deal and part number for the tool holders on eBay. Then call them and give them the part number and ask for their best price delivered to wherever you are. Ask them to make it good because eBay will not get a cut. I did that, got an incredible price, much lower than anybody else would go, They showed up the next day. Sellers are very happy to cut eBay out of a sure deal.
The flip side to Shars is on several occasions I found the Ebay price was less than the website and with free shipping so go figure.
 

Bob Korves

H-M Supporter - Sustaining Member
H-M Supporter - Sustaining Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2014
Messages
4,984
Likes
5,329
#13
The flip side to Shars is on several occasions I found the Ebay price was less than the website and with free shipping so go figure.
That shows that Shars has more wiggle room...
 

middle.road

Actively Learning...
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Apr 28, 2014
Messages
1,295
Likes
665
#14
Sure. That is to pay for the cut that eBay takes off the top and the additional hassles. Work it the other way. Find All Industrial's deal and part number for the tool holders on eBay. Then call them and give them the part number and ask for their best price delivered to wherever you are. Ask them to make it good because eBay will not get a cut. I did that, got an incredible price, much lower than anybody else would go, They showed up the next day. Sellers are very happy to cut eBay out of a sure deal.
Neat, from Chicago - SanFran in a day. FedEX couldn't get those AXA's here in East TN for a week. They sat for (3) days at the airport I believe.
I may try calling shars tomorrow. A dollar here a dollar there and soon you have enough for a gallon of fuel. :grin big:
 

davidpbest

Active Member
Active Member
Joined
Dec 26, 2015
Messages
188
Likes
335
#15
I would still want this on an extra thick backplate to push the collet out away from the lathe spindle nose, closer to the carriage. But it's nice to see someone is finally putting out a Set-Tru style ER40 collet chuck. Thanks for posting this Mark.
 

Alan H

H-M Supporter - Premium Member
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Oct 10, 2016
Messages
904
Likes
909
#16
I would still want this on an extra thick backplate to push the collet out away from the lathe spindle nose, closer to the carriage. But it's nice to see someone is finally putting out a Set-Tru style ER40 collet chuck. Thanks for posting this Mark.
David,
Do you know of a "store bought" backplate that would work for this or would you make one from scratch?
 

mksj

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2014
Messages
1,732
Likes
2,080
#17
Do you know of a "store bought" backplate that would work for this or would you make one from scratch?
The Bison 7-875-054 - 5" D1-4 Back Plate for Set-Tru should work, the insurgent G equivalent would be FLA-125D4 that usually runs about 50% less. You could also call Shar's, they may have one but may not be listed yet. I would call Ajax, I purchased my FLA-125D4 from them, their search function/menu system is poor so it does not show up on their site. The shipping costs with Shar's is disturbing, way out of line with the actual cost and often poor packaging. Almost all their plastic boxes (like parallels) seem to show up broken. I have ordered a few things through them in the last couple of years, some good, some not so good. You get the feeling that there are just a few suppliers and everything is rebranded with the different seller's logo. Still, they seem to do a bit better in the QC department then buying from no-name vendors.
https://www.ajaxtoolsupply.com/bibapldtafor3.html
 

davidpbest

Active Member
Active Member
Joined
Dec 26, 2015
Messages
188
Likes
335
#18
David,
Do you know of a "store bought" backplate that would work for this or would you make one from scratch?
Here is what I did Alan - started with a Bison 7-878-054F backplate that I bought from MSC for $161 (their part #54987250), and added a spacer between it an the collet chuck:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/albums/72157684506733032

I've been super happy with this setup. I needed the collet chuck pushed out because I don't usually have the compound mounted on my PM1340, preferring instead the solid tool post mounting setup I covered in another posting - but shown here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/albums/72157684102384825
 

middle.road

Actively Learning...
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Apr 28, 2014
Messages
1,295
Likes
665
#19
Sure. That is to pay for the cut that eBay takes off the top and the additional hassles. Work it the other way. Find All Industrial's deal and part number for the tool holders on eBay. Then call them and give them the part number and ask for their best price delivered to wherever you are. Ask them to make it good because eBay will not get a cut. I did that, got an incredible price, much lower than anybody else would go, They showed up the next day. Sellers are very happy to cut eBay out of a sure deal.
Bob, could you elaborate on your interaction with Shars? Were you purchasing Tool Post holders or a different item?
Their response on eBay yesterday was a tad short, so I'm sure if it's worth the time to call them. Thanks.
 

Bob Korves

H-M Supporter - Sustaining Member
H-M Supporter - Sustaining Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2014
Messages
4,984
Likes
5,329
#20
Bob, could you elaborate on your interaction with Shars? Were you purchasing Tool Post holders or a different item?
Their response on eBay yesterday was a tad short, so I'm sure if it's worth the time to call them. Thanks.
My transaction was with All Industrial Tools. They are also on eBay, and compete with Shars and the others there. By going direct to them, I took eBay and the tithe they charge out of the equation, also took the competition out of the mix, and by asking them for their "best out the door and delivered to me" pricing I took the shipping game out of the equation and reduced everything to how badly they wanted to make the sale and still make a profit. It worked, and has worked other times as well. Not always...

Don't play their games. Put them on the spot.

Shars seems to be trying to build themselves into the Chinese tools MSC. So is MSC, and others. Yawn.
 

jbolt

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2013
Messages
1,330
Likes
1,185
#22
This is my ER40 collet chuck.

Hex-ER40-Collet-Block.jpg

Under $30. I use it my adjustable 3-jaw chuck. They also make a square block that can be used in a 4-jaw chuck. I recently ran some parts that had milling and drilling ops. Turn the part, take the part still in the holder and run the second ops on the mill.
 

gwade

Active Member
Active Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2014
Messages
55
Likes
18
#23
What is the source of the above hex/square holders? I have an adjustable 4 jaw currently on my lathe. I may be interested in a square block. I've considered making my own since I didn't know they existed.
 

ttabbal

Active Member
Active Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2017
Messages
397
Likes
398
#25
So, I picked one up along with the D1-4 backplate. They don't offer it pre setup. The backplate they recommend is 202-7048.

Packaging was good, no significant damage in spite of signs of rough handling.

I unpacked and cleaned up both parts. So far, pretty good. 2 things I don't like. It doesn't come with a spanner for the nut. That's like selling a 3jaw without the key. I have one that came with the lathe that fits it though. The second is that the threads have chips and lubricant in them. Mildly annoying, but given the price I guess I'll live. :)

I mounted the backplate on the lathe and got the pins set up. It sits nicely on the spindle. It needs to be turned to fit into the chuck. Looks like about 0.1" diameter reduction. That should make it as concentric as possible with my spindle, which is probably the point. Assuming I don't screw it up. :)

Indicating on the OD of the mating surface shows about 2 thou runout. Doesn't really matter I suppose since I have to turn it anyway. I just wanted to see where I was starting from. The face was within 0.0005.

Looking at the chuck, there are 4 set screws around the OD that thread into the mating surface. So I suspect I want to make sure there is a little play in there. Perhaps 10 thou? There are also 4 threaded holes in the front that look like you can use them to adjust the alignment that direction as well, though it did not include screws for those holes. I guess I'll add them if needed. Should the front end of the ER40 taper be accurate enough to adjust that?

I'm reading up on turning cast iron, but hope to have it mounted and indicated over the weekend.
 

mksj

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2014
Messages
1,732
Likes
2,080
#26
On my ER40 Set-Tru that I machined, I gave myself a total of 10 thousandth adjustment room for TIR adjustment. As far as the other face adjustment screws, haven't seen those before, I would first see how it works without using them. Have not seen any ER chuck that comes with a nut wrench unless it is a complete kit, also people often switch out the stock nut to a bearing or higher quality which will most likely use a different wrench. Thread quality, well it is at a price point. I purchased a direct mount ER-40 chuck a couple of ears ago, the TIR was quite bad as well as the fit and finish. But if this new one works, it saves a lot of time and money turning your own. Looking forward to see how yours turns out.
 

ttabbal

Active Member
Active Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2017
Messages
397
Likes
398
#27
I agree on the thread chips, it's made to a price and part of the price for me is cleaning up the chips. Not a big deal. After cleaning the threads are cut well and the nut spins on/off with ease.

I made an HSS tool for cast iron and it cut nicely. I turned it down to leave 10 thou for adjustment.

The adjustment phase was about like indicating a part in a 4 jaw. After playing with the adjustment, I have under 0.0005 indicating on the taper. With a collet and an endmill and a nice straight drill bit, I get right on 0.0005. I expect I could get it better, but I will save that for after I get a 1 tenth DTI. Due to the test materials, I could only test right next to the collet.

Overall I'm quite happy with the chuck and would recommend it.
 
[6]
[5] [7]
Top