Starting a new shop building

[Investigator]

My relief and joy at having the concrete down really can't be overstated at this point. I was ready to pour 3 weeks ago but rain hit just right and there was no way to get the concrete truck to the location off the driveway. This has really held me up. Now, it's almost all my show. At this point the only thing I will have to wait for anyone else to do on the building is the spray foam.

 

[NCjeeper]

The spray foam is cool to watch. I had it done in my previous shop.

 

[Investigator]

Update....
Like I said, things move slow when doing the building your self. Here is the metal frame with trusses up. Still need to weld the purlins on the roof. I expect and plan to finish the purlins and start putting metal roof and siding on this week.

 

[graham-xrf]

It's so different from UK/Europe. US folk have to put in really fat copper, and run such large currents!

I think, if you can get two phases in there with about 230V across, it will have a big benefit. The currents are halved, and the losses quartered. OK - you still have the 115V or so to neutral in between them for lower power kit, and, I suppose, lighting.

Heating + mill + compressor can add up.

 

[Investigator]

It's so different from UK/Europe. US folk have to put in really fat copper, and run such large currents!

I think, if you can get two phases in there with about 230V across, it will have a big benefit. The currents are halved, and the losses quartered. OK - you still have the 115V or so to neutral in between them for lower power kit, and, I suppose, lighting.

Heating + mill + compressor can add up.

Graham, the wires that you see in the photos are actually aluminum or should I say aluminium. They have to be larger than copper to carry the same load. For explanation, I have 4 wires going to the new shop as required by our National Electric Code. I have two "hot" legs or wires each carrying 120VAC, one neutral wire, and one earth ground. I have 240VAC available for circuits by using the two 'hot' legs, or I can use only one "hot" leg in a circuit and have 120v. In total, I have the capacity to carry 240VAC at 200amps to the new shop.

Hope all that makes sense.

 

[extropic]

It's so different from UK/Europe. US folk have to put in really fat copper, and run such large currents!

I think, if you can get two phases in there with about 230V across, it will have a big benefit. The currents are halved, and the losses quartered. OK - you still have the 115V or so to neutral in between them for lower power kit, and, I suppose, lighting.

Heating + mill + compressor can add up.

LOL. I don't know Investigator's intent or circumstances, however it's my experience that we want as much power in our shops as is practicable.
It's not commonly a matter of "have to put in really fat copper". I don't doubt that the 200 amp service to the shop is 230V (two phases with about 230V across).

Edit: Investigator types faster than I peck.

 

[graham-xrf]

Graham, the wires that you see in the photos are actually aluminum or should I say aluminium. They have to be larger than copper to carry the same load. For explanation, I have 4 wires going to the new shop as required by our National Electric Code. I have two "hot" legs or wires each carrying 120VAC, one neutral wire, and one earth ground. I have 240VAC available for circuits by using the two 'hot' legs, or I can use only one "hot" leg in a circuit and have 120v. In total, I have the capacity to carry 240VAC at 200amps to the new shop.

Hope all that makes sense.

Make sense, it sure does! In a previous life, I have often had to juggle with the various (international) power arrangements, sometimes needing to go some distance across fields to for satellite kit using lots of power, via transformers. The main energy is typically to heat a dish against icing up, or a radome, in a place like Inuvik, or Longyearbyen.

@extropic is absolutely right. Your 200A is exactly the right choice. It is actually well more than enough! 46kW is about double what a normal household would need, even with all kit cooking.

It comes on two phases, with 230V across them. These are likely to be from a centre-tapped transformer with the neutral on the centre tap, which would be grounded upstream of safety leakage RCDs. I am sure your electrics guys will fit your place up with all the proper RCD safety leakage current protections.

I would not be a fan of a closed up room with no windows. Were you in a basement all your life? Humans respond well, and are happier if they have at least one window, even if small. Also, put some natural light panels up in the roof, even if they are double layer with air in between. A window is not a place to paste a Starrett decimal conversions poster + lathe oiling chart over. Insulate the place totally - hot or cold, it will pay dividends.

My outhouse-to-be is an entirely more modest affair. I will get back to more stump removal soon. Ugh!

 

[Investigator]

........
I would not be a fan of a closed up room with no windows. Were you in a basement all your life? Humans respond well, and are happier if they have at least one window, even if small. Also, put some natural light panels up in the roof, even if they are double layer with air in between. A window is not a place to paste a Starrett decimal conversions poster + lathe oiling chart over. Insulate the place totally - hot or cold, it will pay dividends.
......

No, I wasn't raised in a basement, but....... I have found in my experience that windows in my shops tend to drive layout within the shop. Seems when I have windows I feel limited on what I can put in various locations, basically working around the windows. In my case I have found that I need walls, not just exterior but interior as well. I need fixed places to run electrical outlets as well as specific assigned places for various tools.
Windows are also terrible for climate control if using a heat or cooling system. In my area of Texas I would literally be forced to spend as much on windows as I do on the rest of the structure in order to get insulation value I need. Having no windows, at least for me, provides a blank canvass so to speak for arranging and rearranging tools and storage.

On a more personal level, my shop is surrounded by hundreds of acres of wild land, no structures in sight other than my home. If I had windows, I would never get anything done in the shop, because I would be watching the wildlife.

 

[extropic]

I like the conversation here. Good back-and-forth.

My shop is a 60' x 80' x 20" eaves, red iron frame with all steel skin. The only windows (2) are in the enclosed "office" area (about 600 sq ft), so no ambient light in the shop.
Although I don't desire windows at ground level, I do resent having to pay for lighting when the sun is bright. I wish the original owner had specified adequate skylights to provide a good percentage of daytime illumination. I imagine his priorities were keeping the cost as low as possible balanced against making the R value as high as practicable. Skylights don't seem to help achieve either goal.

Daylight is good so I may try to implement some Solartube type arrangements someday. It's not high on my project list right now, but it would be if I was building a new shop.

 

[graham-xrf]

Ahh .. OK. I get it. I am also somewhat rural, though perhaps not so far from other farm folk as you.

By day, my place is a many species birds and fowl haven (we feed them).
By night, it's deer, and badger, and fox, hedgehog, whatever.
In the sky too. Red kites, buzzards, sparrowhawks. They are our entertainment, even if it gets a bit bloodthirsty sometimes. I allow myself to get distracted by them.

BTW - even isolated where you are, do you have to have inspections to be conforming to building codes, etc?
Come to that, is the business of putting up the building at all subject to permission?

I am on National Parks protected land. So long as my outbuilding is not in the frontage, is 2m inside of the boundary, and does not take up more than 50% of the land not already under a building (some urban places are on 1/8 acre), I don't need any more permissions. I am surrounded by farm fields. There is another law that the outhouse must not be for human habitation, meaning fitted up with toilets and bathroom, cooking, etc, and people sleeping and living in it.

Dozing off at the bench with the face in the drawings near the beer and pizza-box does not count!