VN Van Norman Parts Machine?

It's a model #2 according to the door on the side of the base. It says Van Norman and has a couple of patent years around 1890. I'll go by my shop tomorrow and take some more pictures. Thanks Cal.

Based on some research on another forum, it looks like the serial number might be from around 1925.
 
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Some more pics. I've searched for a number on the head but I have not found it yet.

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My first goal is to get the mill in some kind of usable state. Everything seems to be movable except that the head is somewhat hard to spin. I'd like to figure out how to clean out the head and re-oil/re-grease it. Any info anyone has would be much appreciated.
 
A couple of more pics of the head.

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Hi Joe,

I can't tell from the photos, but it looks like you might have an adapter in the spindle. A couple of other No. 2 duplex machines have shown up on another site; they seem to have B&S (Brown & Sharpe) #13 taper spindles. B&S #13 was common for larger Van Norman machines prior to WWII; although your machine may well have been made before WWI...

A full length B&S #13 is 1.75" at the small end and about 7.75" long; however, Van Norman used a B&S #13 short taper. Both are about 2” at the large end; I can’t find the specs for the small end of a short #13. How big is the through hole in your spindle? A "modern" Van Norman C-taper spindle would have an ID under an inch; if your ID is closer to 1.75” or larger, it's probably B&S #13. Reach up the spindle nose with a wire bent into a hook and see if you can feel the back of a taper adapter.

Another thing that makes me think that this is a taper adapter is the fact that it's missing the drive lugs for a horizontal arbor, common to all "modern" C-taper spindles. The B&S #13 to C-taper adapters don't have the arbor drive lugs. If it's a B&S #13 you're in luck because you could make up an adapter for something like R8, NMTB-30 or ER-40; NMTB-30 would probably make the most sense because you can get wider range of tooling, including horizontal milling arbors.

Here's a YouTube video of a No. 2 running:You might see if you can contact the owner. I believe that he's up in Ontario.

Van Norman made a smaller version of your machine, the No. 1/2 (say "one slash two"; not "one half"). I used to own one. They are very similar to your machine and even have the November 3, 1896 patent date (but not the 1897). Here's link to a No. 1/2:This one’s overhead motor setup is not typical; most of these machines probably started out life driven by a common, overhead drive line running the length of the shop.

I did a little digging on the US Patent website (http://patft.uspto.gov/) and was able to locate the patents for the No. 2:
NOV.3.1896 = 570,723
MAR.9.1897 = 578,588
The 1897 patent seems to have to do with a worm-drive cutter-head, so I'm not sure how it applies to your machine. Send me an e-mail and I'll send you copies of the patent PDFs.

I also found an article about the machine in a 1896 edition of Scientific American (go to page 201):
Neither the drawings in the patent document nor the Scientific American article show the overarm support for horizontal milling that both the No. 1/2 and the No. 2 have.

As far as lubrication goes, this machine is probably 100 years old. I'm pretty sure that it would have all plain Babbit-type bearings. I don't know what type of grease to use there, but I would definitely consider completely disassembling the machine, cleaning and repairing as I went along. You might check with the guys in the antique machinery forum here. There are other sites with antique metal working machine forums as well. If you do a full rebuild, please give us frequent updates here.

Cal
 
Thanks Cal, What a tremendous amount of info... thanks.

I'd really hate to do a full rebuild. But I may at least disassemble the head. I will certainly upload my progress.

I'm PMing my email address. Thanks for all of your help.

Joe
 
Thanks Cal, What a tremendous amount of info... thanks.

I'd really hate to do a full rebuild. But I may at least disassemble the head. I will certainly upload my progress.

I'm PMing my email address. Thanks for all of your help.

Joe
Hi Joe,

I e-mailed you the patents.

You can easily take the table and saddle off a No. 12, service and reinstall them in a day; I wouldn't think that your No. 2 would be much different. Too bad you're so far away; I would love to come over and help you go through the machine.

I guess as long as the bearings in the drive shafts seem to be tight and sound OK you can leave them alone. If you disassemble the cutter-head, make measurements so that you can get the ring gear back in exactly the same place; you might try using an inside micrometer to measure from the back of the ring gear to the edge of the case. Also take note of how much radial lash there is between the ring and pinion gears.

Do your have the over-arm support bracket? The first picture doesn't show it, but it looks like it's there in the photo of the side of the cutter-head.

I'm very interested to know what you find out about the spindle and whether or not it's B&S 13.

Cal
 
Here is a short video of the VN 21 in action.

[video=youtube;kGY3Z6yhtfM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGY3Z6yhtfM[/video]

Never having machined a head, I am wondering if there a specific reason that it is being cut using a fly cutter? Would a big face mill be preferred?
 
You could do it either way. I assume they were just using what they had. A face mill would allow a faster feed rate and get the same finish because it has more cutting edges. In this case, the horsepower of the machine would not be a factor.

VanNorman makes what they call a rotary broach for surfacing heads, blocks, etc. It uses about a 12 inch cutting head.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JGY9EQmaWw
 
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